hurt Nirensei
heal Mark II Kobayashi Formation
+nirensei
-orthodox
Hurt mark II KoBa formation
Heal micro Chinese
Updated to mark5000ās post.
Hurt Nirensei
Heal Chinese
+chinese
-nirensei
Hurt orthodox
Heal nirensei, the most flexible of openings
+nirensei
-mukai komoku
Iām fortifying nirensei once more, but if lei and kobayashi mark II are to go and kenka komoku is already gone, then mukai komoku should be going too. Itās perfectly playable as a formation for either side but thereās nothing special about it that is strongly independent of what the other player is doing in their corners, and I have a sneaking suspicion that this is why kobayashi mark II is on the chopping block since it is an inherently outward-looking, territorial pattern; its goal is to break up the board first and maybe build the side later.
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hurt Chinese
heal cross hoshi
Updated to mark5000ās post.
+nirensei
-mukai
Hurt lei
Heal small Chinese
+koba MkII
-cross hoshi
The Ancients, the unique candidacy of the last remaining cross opening, and the undoubted fact that cross hoshi leads to a sharp game all withstanding, Iām still not swayed by the general feeling that this opening would not come about by agreement in the zero-sum style. Specifically, I think that either move 3 or 4 of the setup in progress should be played lower. The reasoning is roughly that it is harder to have a dominating sphere of influence in any part of the board in a cross position, therefore a slightly more territorial approach would be good in the opening, because the lost opportunity in the power game would be a little bit smaller. Also, the 3-4 in particular offers some attractive tactics in a loose pincer, again on the idea that the 3-4 has a steady grip on corner eyespace as it is in such a situation and the pincer stone is hard to attack both in the context of the opening and in being distant. The kind of airy running battles that result from a counterpincer against such stones produce a lot of dame and make the center relatively empty, accentuating the benefit of turning a little bit more toward territory in one of the corners.
5-3 in a corner, inviting the taisha, is also probably interesting because of enhanced ladder breaks and the like on the opposite side of the board, but I see no reason why one should have to play into a whole-board joseki in this sort of opening. Again, the penalty of being a little more territorial than usual in the opening should be a bit less, so it would probably be comfortable to invade at the 3-3 instead (if we must prevent the enclosure), precluding the taisha as a matter of course. Center running ladders would also be a concern with a 3-3 invasion beneath 5-3, so Iād be cautious in setting that play up too.
Hurt mukai komoku
Heal cross hoshi
Itās not so much that cross hoshi gives influence as it does fighting potential. Diagonal openings are inherently violent. It is only when the stars are used for attack that they deliver their power.
PS: without more participation we may as well just agree on the winner right now (Please no!).
Hurt Nirensei
Heal Micro Chinese
+lei
-cross hoshi
The hoshi give the influence for fighting in the conflicts of a cross opening which you and I am talking about; lower stones give improved health for a group which is also important if fighting is to take place. The fighting of cross openings as such is mostly only because in most parts of the board itās more likely to be on equal terms with no clear superior player; fighting comes a little bit more often than usual in many such openings, but only as a matter of agreement. To me this doesnāt suggest that itās really important to accept more and more influence, because one isnāt necessarily obligated to fight. Rather I think I expressed my opinion pretty clearly in saying that one can play to defuse the attacking potential of the other player, thus making the fights less aggressive, and making immediate cash even more valuable than it already is in a cross opening, which makes it somewhat harder to build large frameworks.
Meanwhile, I find it amusing that the same person who said that stars should be used for attack is also the one complaining that the lei fuseki canāt be set up through optimal play because a slightly less-than-ideal extension between a corner and a single stone is backed by a wall just behind that stone. One would think that the power of the hoshi stone, now materialized directly as influence along a particular side would only be useful with an actual group trying to invade that area, which to me suggests that the defect is not necessarily going to be an immediate problem.
mark5000, I agree with you that an immediate moyo strategy is not wise for White on that side, because the invasion can probably live and the area is not that big compared with the rest of the board, but I fail to see why this means that White must play with all their eggs in one basket. White doesnāt have territory; White has an area of influence where a weak group may form, and after Blackās invasion at the 3-3, White has sente too. White should continue developing on the rest of the board with that potential weak group in mind and should not be too surprised at being behind on territory for the time being, having accepted power in exchange. The decision to invade that side as Black or to consolidate it as territory as White (or grow the scope into a more significant moyo) is a matter of timing, not an immediately wise choice for either side. Perhaps White does need to emphasize influence a bit and play actively, but this seems like the normal tradeoff between territory and influence to me. I donāt see how White has to commit to playing as if there is only one basket.
I also donāt think there is anything especially out of the normal about having a less-than ideal extension in the opening if aspects of the opposing position are less than ideal as well (such as being too low, especially with respect to oneās own hoshi stone). The situation is unstable as the game develops and can break out in fighting, but the compromise involved in a loose extension is not categorically worse than any other kind of compromise that one has to make in a game that is characterized by the fact that the opponent calls some of the shots, too.
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Hurt mark II Kobayashi
Heal micro Chinese
To severance: I do realize thereās no obligation to fight. Lee Changho 9p taught us as much. Still I see fighting in a kind of inverse relationship with influence. Where fighting is absent influence can show its worth. For example an invasion not played can goad the moyo to grow and/or close off. The conventional wisdom that cross openings favor 3-4 points is a box of rocks if you ask me. In the words of An Youngil 8p, itās only a theory.
Concerning lei, I wonāt tell you it canāt be reached through optimal play. All I can take account for is myself and my own style, and I prefer fast openings. xhu98 will tell you that I have a possibly irrational dislike of enclosures in general. So my hurting lei should come as no surprise to anyone.
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+lei
-cross hoshi
+lei
-cross hoshi
Heal: GanSeYang opening, Strange Opening 6 at senseiās
http://senseis.xmp.net/?StrangeProOpening6
Hurt: Orthodox!