Some idea's for OGS

OGS Development
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Hello everyone I am new to the forum so please be a little patient with me if i have done this wrong…

I wanted to share some of my idea’s that I would like to see in future OGS! For starter’s…

I am not sure about this one but I think your category’s on the forum should be fixed up a bit… I was not sure where to post my idea’s at and if there isn’t an exact place to put them than I think you should make a forum for player’s to share there idea’s or just make it more clear OGS development does not tell other player’s much…

I also think you should put somewhere future planned idea’s so no one does any re-post about the same idea over and over! (also if there is a place that already has this would you be so kind to link it to me! :frowning:)

Thirdly I think you should add a decline button… personally I set a restricted rank so I don’t get opponent’s I would not want to play but… when I get into a match and my opponent is away from his computer maybe he forgot to set the thing? I understand that there is a cancellation button and that the match does not count if they lose on time but how long do we have to sit there and wait to figure out that our opponent is actually not at there computer? I think it would be faster for both player’s if the match just does not open up so they do not have to sit there for 30 minutes to figure out that there opponent is actually away from there computer and not just thinking

Fourthly, I remember player’s talking about kaya.gs about a karma system I think that would be nice! and very cute at that!

Lastly, I think on profile pages wins should be highlighted green and losses shoudl be highlighted red Like the wins/loss ratio thing!

Thanks for taking your time to read this!

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Hi Mikasa,

thank you for the suggestions. New ideas are always appreciated, so feel free to post further improvements, that come to your mind. The “OGS Development” category is the right place to post your suggestions, so no worries.

If you want to have further categories added, this is the place to go: What topic categories should we add/remove/change?

As for the re-post, the current time of the Devs is invested greatly into finishing the next major 4.0 update of the website. Publishing, maintaining and updating a development list surely is a nice thing, but will only keep them distracted. So having an idea re-posted in this forums isn’t a big deal for us. Just keep the ideas coming. :smiley:

I am not sure, if I understand the “decline button” question right. When you notice your opponent is not at his computer, you can cancel or pause the game right away. (Which you prefer). The downside of pausing is, that your opponent can resume the pause, even when you are gone. As for canceling, neither of the two players will lose the game, or rank, if it is done within the first 19 moves. (For 19x19). Feel free to cancel the game right away when your opponent is not there. You can also check out the user-list, which shows you if your opponent is actually in the game.

I have included a picture on where to find the user-list below the post!

For the karma system, I would like to invite you to this topic: Advise to add the rating users function after each game

Feel free to add your thoughts on a user-rating system there, it is appreciated!

I like your idea of a better visualization of the wins/losses, but I am not sure if it’s not already in 4.0. Maybe one of the Developers can clarify this! :smiley:

I hope this helped you out a little!

–

Click on the button in the red circle to see users in a game.

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Thank you for your response Franzisa!

For what I mean by the decline button is well… yesterday I was told we do not have a decline button it is rude… correct? But, you say we can cancel the game within the first 19 moves but isn’t canceling the game in the first 19 moves also rude? How do we exactly know that the opponant is not at there computer and not just thinking? being a 3dan CGA and a 5dan on usual servers I like to spend time thinking in the opening coming up with my strategy for most of the game and that can take quite some time so I don’t think your no decline button removes the idea of “it is rude” I believe there is no decline button because the devs of the website and many other players believe that no decline button makes them feel better but please do not use the excuse of it is rude because it does not fix the rude problem if the opponent does not show in the first 10 minutes that is usually when I leave it is rude but that’s what makes me feel pleased…

I don’t remember posting anything about a user-list? I think I did in the regular chat though… but that was not what i meant… I mean I think there should be a place to find all user’s even the ones that are not online that way you can challange them to correspondence matches or to simply find the strongest player’s on the server or even just to look at there past game records useful yes?

Anyway! thanks for the links to the other 2 forums and yes colorful wins and losses would be much nicer :smiley:

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Oh! I also think it would be a great idea if it told you when someone reply’s to your post :smiley: ? that would be super and if that’s already here too how do I make it show me that?

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Hi Mikasa!

I talked to the Developers about the better visuals of wins/losses and they stated it was already on their list and will be done in the next update! (4.0) :smiley:

The user-list reference was, because it will tell you if an opponent is in your game at all.

The notification after someone replies to your post is somewhere in the settings, I think.

Normally, the forum will give you a number in brackets next to the “New” text in the forum header, though.

Edit: Check the boxes at: http://forums.online-go.com/users/mikasa/preferences

Where it starts with “Receive an email when…” :smile:

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Awesome! (about the visuals!) and thanks I found the notifications thing :smiley: helped a ton

I also have another thing to say! This one I think is kind of weird… or maybe unfair? I have played a 3k twice evenly because they asked me to in ranked matches this player was not provisional I won both games and it did not effect my rank at all not by even 1 point I understand that the difference is big and that might be why it did not effect me but isn’t that a little unfair? if I lose than I lose a lot of points but if I win I don’t even gain 1 point can you even call that rated? should just force it to be unrated if its going to be unfair to the stronger player I tried playing hima gain after to give handicap in rated but he would not even play me if I gave him handicap so why should I play rated games with a weaker player evenly if it is not even going to give me anything ? major problem to fix I think! :frowning:

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The rating system which we currently use, is the European Go Federating Rating System.

You can find all the specifics here: http://senseis.xmp.net/?GoR

We will start to evolve our own rating system over time, but that is not easily done.

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I’m confused. Why do you think a decline button is going to help the situation where the player who opened the challenge is away from the computer? The combination of rank restrictions + the cancellation button seems to solve all of the issues that you think a decline button will solve (plus the addition of a persona non grata list, which is planned for release on beta in the future).

As for the rank issue, restrict your ranked games to specific ranks and play free games when you play weaker players. Again, the solutions for your issues are already in place.

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This feature is now active on the beta site as of last night :slight_smile:

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I thought I mentioned this to you already crodgers? I believe you said that it’s possibly a good idea because the player who set the game does not have to set it up again… which I think is already a good enough reason but I could give more such as I don’t have to wait 5-10 minutes to notice that my opponant does not want to play or is not at his computer instead in 2 seconds I can just move onto the next game why waste my time for 5 minutes to notice that my opponent would have declined a game to me?

Someone said that they do not want a decline button because it is rude… but isn’t leaving the match before 10 minutes also rude? so how does removing a decline button fix rudeness?

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Hello I have come across another thing I feel should be looked at today… I am not sure if I should keep building off my own ideas post… ? or create a new one? for now I will just build off this one! today a friend of mine played a go match and had to leave so he paused the match with his opponent than left while he was gone his opponent un-paused the game and my friend lost on time! I asked and someone said that either player can unpause the game I feel that is very wrong :(! what if a player ask me to pause the game because they have to leave than I leave but then they continue the game??? or if they agree we can pause the game than they continue it when I have to leave? I think player’s should have to agree to pause and unpause the game! if a player is not willing to finish it ever I think something like that should than be taken to a mod!

Edit: I have actually come up with an idea! what if when player’s agree to pause the game since if one might pause it and decide they may never want to continue it when they pause it they can agree on a time limit to return like… they can turn it into a coresspondence game temprarily or one of the players can turn on a 24 hours return countdown and if the opponent comes back and plays a move the one that decided they didnt want to continue but now that the countdown started they have no choice it can just add 24 hours to the person who wanted to continue it in the first place that way it just turned into a correspondence game instead so no one loses on time and the game does nto remain paused forever!

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Hi Mikasa!

Pausing livegames is always a mutual agreement between the players.

If we allowed one-sided pausing of the game, it would cause a lot more abuse, then it would be helpful. In addition to that, not all players want to postphone their livegames 24 hours, because they might not have the time then.

It is very rude to unpause the game after an mutual agreement has been made, but you can’t force your opponent into stopping the game if he does not want it. In my opinion, the consequence should be avoiding to play the person next time, and not more artificial barriers to complicate things. :smiley:

Edit: No worries about a new thread, just keep the ideas coming in this thread!

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Re our pausing system, it’s designed to be fast, fair, and simple. No system is abuse proof, but this one seems to work very well in practice. So well in fact that I’m not sure that I’ve heard of any complaints about it in practice, so I think it’s working out pretty good for people.

If you do have any case examples of where it’s been actively abused though do let us know though.

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Franzisa to start I never said that it should be a one sided pausing of the game but I think players should agree to pause it completely and unpause it completely and or that there should be options to do the 24 hour thing :slight_smile: you misunderstand I think peopel were misunderstanding me about this last night as well when I say the 24 hour thing I am saying it is agreed upon by both player’s what is the player afraid of to say no you can’t pause the game 24 hours? he wasnt afraid to unpause the game so he shouldnt be afraid to decline to agree to add time to the game if its an agreement by both player’s there is nothing wrong with my idea i dont know why peopel think i am talking about a one sided decision… i cant even get that out of what I said…

Yes anoek your system works “now” but youl have more trouble when it gets bigger but there is a saying about laerning things as they come so I guess this is something that can only be learned when it comes but honestly I hope I am wrong and hope that there are more honorable player’s than I thought there were but I think the internet has more “bad players” than “good players” when there is an easy way to abuse a system they will abuse it no matter how nice they seem I had someone I met who was very nice and talked with me the entire game but still tried to cheat in the ending and was still willing to have a nice conversation with me during teh time he was cheating :slight_smile: there are THOSE kind of people which is why I say “AGREEMENT” between player’s not one-sided

OH and by the way your system is very one sided in my opinion if players mutually agree to pause a game and a player later decides they want to unpause the game that is called a one sided decision if that player unpauses it himself that is a one-sided decision :slight_smile: but as i said people live to please themselves can only see the system as you want to see it you did not remove the one sided decision you just came up with a system that you like that is all

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Simple. If your opponent pauses and you don’t trust him, just warn him in chat and unpause it. He pauses again, you unpause it again. Eventually he’ll run out of pauses. Therefore the abuse is completely avoidable. The same time, if there’s mutual trust, the feature is there to use it. It’s perfect so far. :wink:

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We’re hoping that’s not the case. This is the same pausing strategy that StarCraft I and II use, so it works pretty good at scale with less mature players than Go players, so I think it will work at scale here as well.

The problem with the two sided pausing that I see is that it makes the semi-emergency use case very difficult to achieve quickly - that’s the use case when you need to pause to get the door, or you spilled something on your desk, or some other immediate need comes up where you need to quickly pause the game so you can take care of whatever it is you need to take care of. I’d say this accounts for a very large percentage of our pausing needs. I would say if we felt the need for an explicit system to pause the game for a long time so you can come back to it later, we would want to implement a secondary pause that’s more of a two sided pause system like you describe. If that use case starts coming up a lot, we’ll be happy to look at doing that, but at this point I think it’s more of a theoretical exercise, I think most people playing RT games just sit down and play all the way through. Generally speaking, unless it’s with a friend, I don’t think it’s common to want to pause for an extended period of time so that you can later resume the game. I could see that need arising for multi-day tournament games or something, but at this point we don’t have any demand for that (but would be awesome to do someday!)… so maybe when we start getting there we’ll revisit and add a secondary pause :slight_smile: