Can we rework policy around conditional moves so that it becomes a popular part of OGS?

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21

Is there something that I need to do to have this issue put on an official suggestions or issues list? :slight_smile:

22

Enable conditional moves and disable analysis. I think with locked moves like SanDiego suggested, the problem will be solved.

Just a thought experiment for me, (please help me if I miss a point):

Assuming one is white.

  • White chooses the next move (like normal) and hit 'lock" (= send) button
  • after that White can think about Black’s next moves and hit “lock”
  • …and so on.

For diffrent variations White can go back in the path, but only to White’s locked moves and assume a diffrent followup black path,
and then his white always locked responses.

If the real Black chosses his course of action, the white locked variations will be played.

Therefore White can cjoose conditional moves, but can’t take it back after learning about a bad outcome (in the virtual game).
That means White see only that far what it is risk to play.
White has to plan careful like in the real game, There is no undo for white stones.

Or do I miss something?

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23

sTan, I think you hit the two stones right on their head there :slight_smile:

Wish there was a way to get this suggestion added to an official “review” list or something like that.

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24

There are two ways - it’s not clear which has the best chance :slight_smile:

  1. File a suggestion here: https://github.com/online-go/online-go.com/issues

  2. File a suggestion here, and get people to vote for it: https://ogs.uservoice.com/forums/277766-online-go-com-suggestions-and-feature-requests

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25

I have seen several ideas implemented through github… to my knowledge I’ve never seen anything on uservoice get implemented

26

As far as I understand github is kept mainly for bug reports and pressing problems…

While uservoice is for future ideas and possibilities. Thus it may seem “ignored” a bit because it is not high priority usually… But I know of several that have been implemented (and you can check those on uservoice)

Unless told otherwise I would (only personal opinion) try to keep github as clean as possible to keep the “pressing” issues able to be quickly resolved and not hidden under an onslaught of (while often good) ideas that can wait.

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27

I guess it’s also important to remember that github has its issue report section but also it’s PR section, so that’s I think why I thought of it for feature improvements as many have come in recently through PRs :slight_smile:

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28

Ok, now I am gonna embarrass myself, but as far as I understood Pull Request are for third party written pieces of codes, ready to be implemented, not for ideas. So if you are a coder and want something improved then by all means go for it, but for us “normal” humans this section should be “off limits” no?

Am I wrong? :smiley: Or did I miss something completely?

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29

No embarrassment, I believe that is essentially correct. Though we have quite a few people that like helping and PRs are not always as “ready to implement” as the coder thinks, so this section can be as open for discussion as the issues section is :slight_smile: and quite often I have observed bug fixes and QoL improvements rolled into one since they can often affect the same system which is why some discussion of site improvements inevitably ends up in the “issues” section.

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30

Well, happy I have not been completely off :smiley: thanks for clarifying :slight_smile:

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31

Guys, there are 15125 correspondence games going on right now, and I don’t understand how such a thing is possible with the automatic locking of conditional moves. Do people really enjoy waiting 1 day to connect an atari???

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32

I dont think many people see it like that. Since a lot of players have an abundance of games active (to the point where it is almost too much) its actually a nice change of pace to just connect to an atari without thinking and then go on to the next game where a hard decision awaits. That, i believe, is also the main reason why conditional moves are underused even when availible.

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33

I also think it’s a reason to get conditional moves working, so people would play more moves in less games.

It’s clearly a matter of opinion only, but my opinion is that more moves in less games is “better” than less moves in more games.

If you have 7 games going at 1 move per week, it seems crazy to me - that means that you have a gap of 6 days between connection with each game, rendering it more like a “full board puzzle” than a game.

You could play the same number of moves per day - 1 move per day - in one single game going at one move per day.

I really don’t understand why people don’t do that: more connection with each game, better “quality of play”.

GaJ

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34

Another reason some people don’t use conditional moves may be that they have no idea how to do so. I fall into that group. I don’t think it is explained anywhere on the site.

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35

What is there to not understand? It’s all in the name…

You click on the “conditional moves” tab and it opens up an analysis window of sorts…

Play alternating opponent moves and your responses and after submitting if your opponent plays any of your “pre-conditioned moves” then your responses will be auto played.

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36

Thanks. I don’t remember a conditional moves tab in the correspondence games I played a while back, but maybe I didn’t notice it or maybe I saw it but didn’t want to click it not knowing what I would have to do. As I hope to undertake some new correspondence games shortly, this will be useful.

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37

It can also be disabled if the game has analysys disabled

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38

This is precisely the problem. OGS links a player’s ability to use conditional moves with both player’s willingness to allow “game analysis” - in other words, by default, you will never see the conditional move tool.

The argument here is that separating the two tools (and automatically allowing conditional play) can only benefit players who play correspondence go.
Tool 1) Game Analysis (unrestricted board to play out variations on)
Tool 2) Conditionals Moves (restricted board where you must confirm a move before playing more, and once you confirm it, you cannot take it back); in addition, possibly limit the number of moves to 3 or 5 locked moves.

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39

some information about conditional moves can be found here, as well as on other features of OGS. I was surprised not to find a link to this page on OGS itself. Did I overlook it?

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40

Thanks.