Cheating, but not really cheating

Yeah, I remember when I first started with Go and never played online, but at RL meetups. There were some quite strong players there, so I got to play most of my games against 3k to 3d players with handicap. They sometimes talked about how some moves were overplay (I think they never called it trick play), and they advised me against playing online because people there would use lots of overplay and that would just teach me bad style…
But this advice just meant I learned less. :wink: Because obviously one still needs to learn how to defend oneself against trick plays.

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I dont know whats the correct word for it, but ive heard ppl calling moves like A and B as “cheating”

Move on A is sente for black, and if black plays it as a ko threat then white will most likely answer it. But, if black leaves A unplayed until there is just small yose left, and black plays there instead taking last 5-point move, you can kinda say that black is “trying to cheat white into tenuki”

Move on B has the opposite situation. After that joseki, blacks B has not been sente. But if black has played it in the middle of some small ko-fight, one could say that black was “cheating white into believing that was sente”

Its more like about timing than anything else, a player is trying to mask their gotes as sentes, or vice versa, by choosing to play their moves in such a time when opponent is more likely to answer/tenuki

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What cheating?

“All warfare is based upon deception.”
Sun Tze, Art of War

:joy:

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I sought the advice of someone knowledgeable :wink:

In the game of Go, a hamete play refers to a clever and unexpected move that takes advantage of the opponent’s anticipated response. The term “hamete” comes from the Japanese language and roughly translates to “trap” or “ambush.” Hamete plays are strategic moves designed to deceive the opponent and lead them into a trap.

The concept of hamete revolves around exploiting common patterns and typical responses that players tend to make in certain situations. Skilled Go players often develop a deep understanding of these patterns and use them to their advantage. By playing a move that seems enticing or tempting, they lure their opponent into making a predictable response that can be exploited later.

The success of a hamete play relies on the opponent falling into the trap and responding as expected. If the opponent makes the anticipated move, the player who set up the hamete play can then employ a follow-up move that turns the situation in their favor. This can result in gaining a better position on the board, capturing stones, or securing an advantageous position for the rest of the game.

Hamete plays require a good understanding of the game’s strategy and the ability to anticipate the opponent’s moves. They often involve sacrificing some stones or territory in the short term to gain a larger advantage in the long run. It’s important to note that hamete plays are not guaranteed to succeed, as skilled opponents may recognize the trap and deviate from the expected response.

Overall, hamete plays are a fascinating aspect of Go strategy, adding depth and complexity to the game. They demonstrate the importance of foresight, deception, and the ability to think several moves ahead.

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I was watching Triton Baduk and he made a play and said, “that move was a scam by the way. But it worked.” A lot of times I wonder if a move I made really should have worked or was a scam. I suppose I should have known there was an established name for it.

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This discussion about what’s fair and what’s not reminds me of several previous discussions in this forum.

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Go works best when played between players of the same rank, because their knowledge and experience are close to each other. If there is a small disparity, then a handicap is applied. But then the nature of the game changes, because special defense and attacks are in focus, involving the handicap stones. It’s bad enough when only one player knows some of these ‘special’ handicap moves, but it’s even worse when an advanced player makes use of their unique knowledge and experience to crush the weaker opponent, such as by capturing all their stones. This is cheating, because the more advanced player is failing to keep the game even so the win will be a small, sportsmanlike win. The more advanced player has a choice of how to play. If their choice is lazy and makes the beginner feel bad, then this is cheating. A more accurate word is “unsportsmanlike”, or even better, “mean”.