"No Undo" option?

Yeah, so for me I’d set up correspondence games with “no undo” and leave undo as an option for live.

But it’d be a choice eh…

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I could see the value add in having ranked games be “no undo” by default.

In unranked play I’ll usually grant it if I notice the request in time (sometimes I register that there was an undo request a moment too late) and maybe get a chance to see a stronger response & learn something.

But I can certainly see “no undo” being an option.

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There is no rule saying that player has to accept that undo request. Asking and granting undos are always something that both players agree together, so i don’t understand the reasoning why it should be prevented altogether.

For a context: i don’t think i’ve never denied an undo request, because i have faith on people. Also i don’t want a good game to turn into a crap just because a screw-up on stone placement.

Yeah, i’ve set it double-click on corr games, and few times misclicked because i’m using laptop without a proper mouse. I agree, it’s totally my own fault, but i’m still thankful for those players who have granted my undo requests. And i’m not blaming those who haven’t, they have all the rights to just continue playing after my misclicks.

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Well, not that I am against having the option, but do we really need a setting for everything? :smiley:

If you don’t wanna undo, just don’t undo… :slight_smile: And it might just suck if in such a game a really obvious misscklick happens and you can’t undo it…

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As I said…

… I would rather my opponent and I agree up front that there aren’t going be undoes, then I don’t get that question.

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I think what @GreenAsJade is trying to say is that some people feel uncomfortable declining an undo request and we have certainly seen some unpleasant results discussed in the forum (eg: Communication ban, permanent?). His proposal would improve the OGS experience for those players perhaps?

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(merged from a separate topic)

One feature I would love to see added to OGS is the option to disable undos. With this option selected, there would no longer be an undo button for you and your opponent.

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There seem to be three different opinions on undos:

  1. No undos
  2. Only for misclicks
  3. Undos for any bad move

I tend to be in the 2. camp, largely because I benefit in turn from others in the 2. camp. But players in the 3. camp must respect the position of the players in the 1. and 2. camps, and the 2. camp players that of the 1. camp. Otherwise, we can’t play together in harmony.

It is true that there are some players who will harass for undos, and there are even some players who will ask for undos and will not extend the same courtesy in return. Ultimately, I think you must stick to your own stance on undos and not expect anything from the opponent. I reckon it is not too hard to say “Sorry, I don’t do undos” rather than rely on a setting. And if they say “F*** you” and quit, it is no loss to the righteous player.

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My idea was more along the lines of Lichess.org’s implementation, where the ‘no undo’(takebacks) setting is implemented on a player level rather than a per-game level.

I wish I could be in the #2 camp but the issue is that it’s not possible to actually know if it’s a genuine mis-click.

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If a minute goes by and they ask for an undo, it’s pretty safe to say it wasn’t a misclick. Or if you give them an undo and then they play on the other side of the board…

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Well, firstly, what if someone’s cat spills something, causing a mis-click combined with an urgent distraction (save the computer before asking for an undo)…

In the second example, you’ve already given someone an undo in order to determine whether they mis-clicked.

I guess for now I’ll just have to stomach the unpleasantness of explaining my ‘no undo’ policy every time someone asks for one. No big deal. I just wish it could be like lichess. If their no takebacks feature was exactly copied here, that would be awesome.

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Again, I am not against having the option, but just to offer a possible counter thought, I am afraid the option might not help with the problem per se. Just as some people are surprised the rules are chinese, or the time settings are too short or there is a handicap… This might just be another preference, people just do not feel like checking and get grumpy anyway.

And as my personal preference, I would not wanna “ruin” a nice game with a silly missclick. But I play mostly for fun, I understand that with a more “competitive” approach this may be an issue.

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Well, the way it is on lichess works great in my experience. I’ve found my chess games much more enjoyable since I’ve discovered that feature. I’ve experienced no drawbacks from implementing it since years ago.

I think that in any game there should be the opposition for undoes. That being said, I have my owe personal rule I have for undoes. I will allow undoes if i can see that it is a blatant misclick or it will kill you if and only if we are not fighting for one of ours group to live. I think that we all agree that if I ask for an undo later I will grant one to my opponent if they ask and vice versa.

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Hi, I’ll my two cent in. I think undo’s are apart of the games, We are all amateurs and playing fun and hoping that our skills will improve. Instead of no undo’s game we have an opposition of limits of undo’s, to like 3 or 5 per player per game.

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I don’t like undo’s generally although I will say that the ‘misclick’ does happen occasionally. I’d say I’ve had one or two in the past year.

I think that there are two possible options I might add:

  1. Require an explanation when asking for an undo. Unless it is a misclick I generally will not allow, especially in ranked games. I suppose someone can be dishonest if they want, but most aren’t.
  2. Have a ‘delayed submit’ option (5 seconds or so) in which you can click ‘undo’ before the move is actually submitted.
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That sounds OK for unranked games, but a ranked game is not about “I’ll see what this looks like if I place a stone here, my opponent won’t mind”

Wow, you are in a different way of thinking than me. I have never had an opponent ask for a second undo, and I almost certainly would say “no, please be more careful with your move selection”.

GaJ

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This is slightly off the original topic but I see value in playing both ways.

With a relaxed approach to undoes players can gloss over the more trivial mistakes and gain some appreciation of Go played at a higher level of ability.

At some point however, I think it’s essential to create a clear line between the thought process of deciding what to do and acting upon it. If a person always plays with undoes in mind it is likely to limit their progress.

I remain unopposed to the original idea,

I just wouldn’t want to use it myself, preferring the flexibility of being able to say yea or nay.

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I’ve watched several games, all 9x9, in which a player asked for more than one undo—cheating, I think.

I think having that option would make people think it is acceptable to ask for undo in a normal game(even when it is not a misclick). I think not every culture believe that it is a impolite thing to do so adding that option would give some people the wrong impression.

Misclick in correspondence does happen once in a while(maybe once a year) when I play on mobile on plulic transit, there is one time that accidentally clicked again on the border with my other finger after making my move and submitted that wrong move.

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