2021 Rating and rank adjustments

@anoek , it seems problem is bigger than just sort of names in chat

2021 Rating and rank adjustments - #410 by stone_defender

Kosh in help chat just said:

and there is also this

3 places where system thinks that [?] are 6k?
Coincidence? Or they really work more like 6k than we think?


Good stuff for the Controversial Go Opinions thread! :wink:


humble rank still works, it just got a huge bump up with all the other ranks… it is one of the items anoek will be reviewing “when the new ranks settle” (not a specific set time, see also Soon™)


what “humble rank” means?
(I ignored that word and talked about rank restriction problem only)

ratings come with a confidence interval, say 1500 +/- 350 for new accounts. Instead of pairing new accounts with “real” 1500’s the system pretends their rating is the lowerbound rather than the centre, effectively 1150 +700 -0 which has the effect of pairing new account with weaker players, but also projecting them higher if they win.

As confindece interval goes down (rating gets more accurate), the effect is diminished until it disappears entirely at the point of an official rank being given (that being below a 160 confidence interval).


Okay. Thankyou. If everything is as intended then I am okay with it. My concern was that it may have been unintentionally broken and a contributing factor in this case:

and this scenario seemed likely to become more common.


Yeah I think it’s fairly certain that humble rank, or entry rating, or both, are too high currently… I suspect anoek just wants more data on which to base any changes in this area, rather than guessing at ‘better’ numbers

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This seems questionable. New accounts are 6k plus uncertainty and shown as ? But show as 6k in chat, group list etc. And also their humble rank is also 6k from @Kosh’s experience. So it might be “working” in some kind of software sense (people have a rank and a humble rank and the humble rank is used at the right time etc etc) but it sounds not to be working in a “doing what it is supposed to in real life” sense.

What is the “new rating” humble rank equivalent to?as compared to the new rating centre point rank (which seems to be 6k now - and used to be 13k or so as I recall)

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This must be a chat display bug, if you go to their profile page they display correctly as (a humble) 11.9k

it’s worth noting that the ratings for new accounts and humble rating were never changed, only the ranks to which they map to…


But it’s more than a chat display bug if they are also able to accept games as if they are this rank?

in English chat yesterday I heard about several new accounts that plays Go really bad, but got SDK ranks and their ± interval became really little

(probability of it increases when too new accounts able to play with too high ranks)

hmm, yes AFAIK this shouldn’t be possible. While they are ‘technically’ 6k, they should be treated as 12k by the server, and thus should not be able to accept 6k+ game restrictions…


Suffice to say that there are definitely at least a few known things wrong currently, and humble rank operation is suspected. It may actually be only one bug underneath it all.

I fear all we can do is wait now for the assessment/fix from @anoek. Some things certainly appear broken at the moment.


That doesn’t seem right.

I looked at a new person’s profile and they show as 11.9 +/- 4.9 which seems correct.

If don’t think that the entry point rank should have moved - it’s chosen because it’s halfway across the range, right? In the midpoint so that entries there don’t skew the pool?

Therefore the humble rank should show as 19k, just like it did before.

However, something is afoot…

New person, rank that I would expect to see:

New person after 1 game … mostly as I would expect to see:

All except that the uncertainty bar on the graph is all above their initial rank dot, implying that the rank dot is the humble rank, and the actual rank is higher (as BHydden thought).

This flies in the face of everthing else though.

So many mysteries… but the good thing is that this particular new person shot down do 21k after losing a game. So “it worked” for them…


Also, new person without any games. 6k.


The humble rank was never “19k” it was “1150” which at the time mapped to 19k, now 1150 maps to 11.9k


And yet … those screenies…

is that some custome CSS on your end???


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I dont think so? Ok, now i’m just confused xD

Koba’s screenshot of Antonka looks identical to what I see

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