And now I won another game and my rank went down AGAIN

Is there not a bug/typo in the volatility or did that get fixed?

Wasn’t one of the intentions of the recent ratings changes to stop ratings going down after a win. It’s too confusing, enough people don’t seem to like it, so it’s not worth advocating for in my opinion.

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Actually if you look at the profile of Tetrapheny etc… https://online-go.com/player/738093/ one can see his rank is oscillating more wildly after beg of june when the new system was enabled (Ok this could be due to other factors like the way he plays or select his opponent)

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That’s not the explanation. His rating went down because some of his past opponents have lost rank and therefore some of his past wins against them are worth less than they had been when previously assessed.

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Yes, but as you can see it isn’t working. This became evident soon after the change, apparently because the tweak that anoek made wasn’t working for some reason. Hence the principle, I as I understand it, still holds.

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Yes, but we still do “time machine” thing with your own rank. The system bases your new rank on the rank you had 15 games ago, and takes into consideration how you performed in your newer games. Basically, if you were stronger 15 games ago, your losses will count more, if you were weaker 15 games ago, your wins will count more.

I should admit that I’ve stopped really following the rank discussion, so I’m not sure if I’m correct.

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You mean this?

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This is confusing, two FAQ’s on this site:

  1. FAQ - Frequently Asked Questions
    (mentioned above)
  2. https://forums.online-go.com/faq (OGS’s etiquette)

Yeah, that second one should probably be renamed… honestly though, not many people find it :sweat_smile:

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Surprised that it is not found by many, but we seem to be drifting away from the original topic.

Well the topic " My rank decreased after a win / My rank is behaving weird" is lat updated in Dec 2019 so before the June 2020 change.

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Yeah, the specifics of why has changed slightly, but essentially it’s still the same.

It has not yet been updated because anoek isn’t satisfied with our current implementation and is working on more changes.

We’ll adjust the faq once the situation stabilises.

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Thanks for explaining this. My point is that the games should show as annulled, perhaps with a question mark icon that players can click to find out why. In other words, make the rating system more transparent and less confusing to players.

I went on hiatus this March (thus losing all my games by timeout), returned in June and have completed 30+ games since then (no losses by timeout, some wins due to opponent timing out), but the “has recently timed out of a game” still appears on my profile.

The “recently timed out” indicator still appears on my profile

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Hmm, yesterday I saw a player who had timed out in the last few games without that flag. Maybe there is some problem around this currently?

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You are right, the timeout indicator should not be there. I tried to remove it, but the system would not let me do that.

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This has come up before and would be a good proposal for another thread.

Although I suspect the only impediment is that only @anoek can do that one.

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I asked anoek about the issue of the timeout indicator, and he said it is known and in the queue for a fix.

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What I like about GoQuest is that they weren’t afraid to make something different.

Maybe we should make achievements system so people pay less attention to their ranks.

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Yeah, this would be the way of modern games. Wolfey Studios’ Conquest of Go is tapping into some of that player reward mechanic.

If OGS started taking steps in that direction, it could be a journey into many new things. The discussion could have its own thread, starting with a question like, “what is the purpose of OGS?”

Does OGS have a Mission Statement? Would player achievements align with that mission?

Then there could be examination of what achievements and related modern game developments do as far as the player experience and changing the game.

(Aside: every time I see this thread come up with a new post, I have a moment where I read the instance as happening again. “I won and my rank went down AGAIN! IT KEEPS HAPPENING!” :laughing: :crazy_face:)

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Interesting to know how it works. Now it is clearer to me and there is also a logic behind it.

I don’t want to open a discussion on the rating system, but please consider it as a possible improvement.
Perhaps to get around the problem of decrementing the rank in case of a win, the calculation in the system should weights the last 15 results avoiding a full step jump in the 15th game.

What about a normalized weight that fades with older games and becomes 0 on the 16th game? Weights in each position of the queue from 1 to 15 could be adjusted to avoid this annoying effect.

Also, if you win a match against a strong player now, you would get the maximum reward in your rank immediately (people will be happy to see it) then - playing new matches - the increasing effect in your rank of that specific victory would be gradually diluted. As soon as that game progress through the queue until the 15th position, its effect is cancelled.

In other words, the overall effect that inspired this mechanism should be safeguarded, but the “strange” decrease (or increase) in your rank would be spread over 15 games instead of one single game. @anoek it makes sense?

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This is the part of the algorithm in the calculation that really I don’t understand. My rating shouldn’t be affected by the result of the games of one of my previous opponents for the games that he/she play in the future. It appears bizarre to me.

EDIT:

Ops… I should read all the thread before to write :grin:

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