Are you worried about coronavirus?

That’s quite impressive actually. Here there is not enough police or any community service to do any of that sort, so they are just occasionally guarding the main highways. You can slip into towns and villages from at least 3-4 other rural or farmer roads though (a lot of people use them when they are drunk and do not want to risk being stopped by the police).

If the locals want to pass, they will find a way. That is why abiding by the law is not really about enforcement, but actually convincing people that they are serious measures/rules that are needed for the benefit of everyone and will have actual good results. Which makes my aforementioned worries even larger.

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Welp, some of our precious citizens moved around to Dubai. :stuck_out_tongue:

As a whole (I mean people everywhere), we have behaved so erratically, course correction is far behind us, the course was rewritten. I wonder where it leads now.

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Indeed. In the UK we now have a much more serious situation than last spring (new variant, deaths at previous peak levels, +50% in hospital with covid, Christmas relaxation of rules not fully hit yet, etc etc.) And with a lockdown as stricter or stricter than before. But streets much busier, (closed) schools less empty…

I think people have the vaccine in mind and think “my little transgression doesn’t matter since the cure is coming”. Or something like that.
Also a bit of “I followed the rules last time so I’ve earned a bit of flex this time” or “others did/are not following the rules so I don’t need to bother so much”

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Governments being untrustworthy is a huge factor, imho.

A few weeks ago, police basically beat up a teen girl for being outside a bit late without a mask, but this week’s churchgoers went around unmasked and peachy.

Anger and disbelief are only natural to follow.

I mean, I obviously believe covid is dangerous etc, but someone thinking “well, if it’s that dangerous why* the authorities let churches go on?”, well, I’m not sure I can blame them that much anymore.

*I know why, because our government is a circus, and not the lion tamer kind, the clown kind.

But leadership has failed absolutely everyone. It’s unbelievable how incompetent you are allowed to be after you pass a certain power threshold.

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We don’t have anywhere near the same kind of church power in the UK (despite having bishops in the House of Lords) and I don’t personally feel that the rules are too nonsensical. But there is a basic boundary issue/risk balance that different people take different views on which probably makes it impossible to arrive at a rational system.

Have you seen our PM?

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You mean the rules that are in place there or the rules here?

Church has been extremely combative (and winning I may add) in many subjects here. Covid is just the latest sad example.

I never said we have exclusive rights, but we are part of the clown-governed elite nonetheless.

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I mean here. It’s hard enough to keep up with the rules for England. I can’t even manage to follow the rules on other parts of the UK let alone further flung places. And since I’m not allowed to go anywhere anyway…

But that is also part of the problem, the rules change so much over time and in contradictory ways. In the autumn we had the rule that you could not meet others at home but you could if you were in a pub. At Christmas the rule was that you could meet others at home but not in the pub.
Now pubs cannot serve alcohol to takeaway but off licenses (takeaway alcohol shops) can because they are “essential retailers”.

The situation for churches is also not clear. You can attend a church for communal worship as long as you are alone… Which doesn’t sound very communal to me. Most churches closed anyway I think or at least are only open for private prayer with services being conducted online only. Funerals is different but at least the rules for those have never changed as far as I can tell.

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Lol, I thought so, I just wanted to make sure you weren’t referring to something I said, ie to clarify it.

Imagine the history tests of the future:

In November 2020, what were the coronavirus measures in Kent?
A. Mask wearing
B. Social distancing
C. Curfew
D. All of the above
E. A and B

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Sadly those future students of history are likely to get higher marks than the residents of Kent might have at the time…

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We once had a prime minister that managed to mangle his fingers with this fantastic way:
He was on a bicycle and the chain went out of the spokes, so he considered it a very “smart” thing to try to fix the bicycle chain while the bicycle was moving with him on it, and of course the chain mangled his hand. Can Boris really top that, I wonder? :sweat_smile:

I think people have the vaccine in mind and think “my little transgression doesn’t matter since the cure is coming”. Or something like that.

Well, that will take months. A LOT of months. I honestly hope that not many people think that way.

Funerals is different but at least the rules for those have never changed as far as I can tell.

I expect any day now from some government official to prohibit people from dying and urge us to postpone our departure from life for the foreseeable future, in order to not be a burden. :upside_down_face:

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Ummm, err, well, that might get a bit (more) off topic (Brexit anyone?) but we are champions of Europe for covid deaths (80,000) on his watch and he does like bicycles too…

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Hey, where’s the discretion advised notification for that picture? HELP MY EYES.

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(timestamp for the discussion, all of it for anyone interested)
I don’t know who the lady is, but that’s basically it, isn’t it? For most of us*. Rich people need their money, pandemic who :man_shrugging: :woman_shrugging:**

*(if there’s millionaires on OGS, please accept my resume. k thanx)

**we need a robot shrugging emoji for AlphaGo discussions

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The economy certainly features heavily in the politics. But I also wonder how much the event of Christmas played into this. I realise that that is also basically all about money when it comes down to it but there is also a strong “over by Christmas” physiological legacy in the UK I think. Plus the sense that people will meet at Christmas anyway or if they are denied this then the mental health hit is more significant then at other times. But maybe this is all just a cover for :pound::pound::pound:?

In my opinion, Christmas is, undistinguishable in current society from its religious importance for many people, a very prominent economic event. Gifts, new outfits, celebratory purchases, all those family visits mean shopping and spending in every level, from nails done to groceries for 20 people. Traditionally, there’s also extra money to spend (bonuses and stuff, either end-of-year unofficial ones or mandatory by law).

Note: Saint’s days celebrations are very important here, especially the patron saints of prominent cities. Salonica’s (Northern Greece) patron saint day is October 26th. A (stain of a) Minister that we (are deeply unfortunate to) have, basically admitted that they left Salonica open in Autumn because they didn’t dare close down the city and prevent the patron day celebration. Northern Greece is struggling, really struggling with cases right now. I wonder what the superspreader event was, hm.

Festivities always mean spending one way or another, holly festivities usually include institutional as well as personal spending (by the way, Christmas lights and decorations is a traditional way to line Greek mayor pockets, I don’t know about yours).

Church (all of them are powerful financial institutions, and you’ll find them in boards you wouldn’t believe, but I’m mostly talking about our Monolithic one) is a vector for most people’s actions. If milestone holidays and church events aren’t strong enough to pull people away from official government directions, their power is de facto lessened (not in so may words, but they basically say so). And of course all the money that revolves around those holidays that makes a steady stream of income for the church, it needs to flow.

I can confidently say for ours, that this last event with Epiphany was another show of power. Who can make the people do as they say (spoiler, government was sent home with its backside bruised). And the reason power is demonstrated is, in direct or indirect ways, always for some kind of profit.

I believe the Christmas milestone was important in our minds (the same way Easter way early on in this disaster, and then Summer, and then Southern hemisphere Summer…) as a psychological reason. Because we are tired and disheartened and worried.

But for the decision makers, the milestone was important for end-of-year profits, (utter uselessness in leadership, I mean, simple stupidity is a factor we shouldn’t leave out), and bosses becoming restless with all they money they are losing (and having to pretend they struggle with quarantine in mansions or in vacations abroad). They can only pretend to care for so long.

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I hear a lot of news about a rapid increase in the UK, but wat is happening in Ireland?
I hear little about the situation in Ireland in Dutch media, but this graph look pretty worriesome to me:

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That does look bad. The impact of Christmas and the new variant it seems.

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Yeah it’s pretty worrisome being in Ireland at the moment. Meant to make a post about it when we were at 3k cases a day, being already twice the daily amount at its worst so far comparing the increases in March/April and October/November, but now we’re at like 6-8k cases.

I think in October November we saw increases in cases after the summer. I think a bunch of people wanted to blame schools pubs etc and the government would be happier blaming home visits and socialising rather than anything to do with schools. Eventually you hear from family that’s there’s cases in schools and crèches but really not in the media, and then eventually you hear of outbreaks in schools closer to December. In any case they’re probably right that it’s only a small factor compared to social visits etc, but it did feel very underreported.

Anyway regardless of that, we had different restrictions based on the region of the country, with higher restrictions when case numbers went up locally and then a big lockdown I think in November to squash numbers again. Then restrictions lightened a lot apart with Dublin maybe a bit tighter, coming up toward Christmas. We then allowed Christmas shopping and pubs being open provided you bought food (which some places probably took advantage of). Then I think a lot of people moved around over Christmas. It’s probably not too bad if you visited your family and stayed only with them with limited contacts for 1-2 weeks of the Christmas period, a lot of people working remotely anyway nowadays.

I think a lot of socialising over Christmas/New Years happened though, and then here we are, back to level 5 lockdown everywhere trying to control things but case numbers have exploded with a lag even in reporting as the system tries to keep up with it.

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Here’s a good Twitter thread regarding transmission risks:

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