Joseki online tool


#1

Any suggestions on website to study Joseki? I noticed Josekipedia and GoBase and would like to get your veteran’s input which is better. Note, I don’t really care about the pro games etc at GoBase, at least at this point. :joy:


#2

I wish their board UI is as pretty as OGS.


#3

That’s a tricky question. Unfortunately most databases are outdated, as in the past two years refutations have been found to traditional joseki, and new joseki have surfaced.

I would recommend to start with @mark5000’s compilation of AlphaGo joseki. Other than that, your best bet is probably Youtube and blogs, especially content published in the second half of 2018, where people discuss the evolution that happened in the past two years. You can search this forum for Youtube channels in English, then there are many more in Asian languages.

For the record, my favorite online reference for studying joseki is (was) Sensei’s library


#4

Thanks! I really look for easy to learn, not as a reference, easier to see different variance etc, and as long as the joseki is legit at some point in time. At 3k, I don’t really worry about the latest and greatest.


#5

Well, that’s exactly why I warned you that refutations have been found to joseki that were considered legit just two years ago. It’s not just about fashion.


#6

I made an edit when you were replying. :joy:


#7

@drifterwolf to back my first reply, and to help you think about it, a little Christmas present. Just listen for a couple minutes :slight_smile:

I guess one of my points here is that a joseki database is not the easiest way to learn. Just like reading a dictionary is not the best way to learn a language.


#8

Thanks! Merry Christmas!

Now you read my mind. I am really looking for a place/tool to learn a little Joseki and help me visualize and memorize a little faster than books.

This will help.


#9

My favorite: http://www.josekipedia.com/
It’s edited by users, I don’t really know how it works but it seems to be updated on a regular basis; I use to use eidogo but josekipedia show you more variations.

@SanDiego: about recent refutations, could we suppose that Alphago and others, as they improve, will soon refute their own refutations? Therefore we should be careful about these recent refutations and wait a year or two to see if those are stable?..
Or should we consider the most recent josekis as best, because they’re created/validated by the best AI we have, and future ones will be even better?


#10

That’s possible, and indeed what happened for the 3-3 invasion between the first version of AlphaGo and AlphaGo Zero.

I don’t think so. The refutation explains why the old sequence is actually not joseki. If a refutation to the new joseki comes up, I would expect that it’ll lead to a brand new sequence, not back to the older sequence anyway.


#11

can any one tell what is joseki?
i don’t know what is it ?


#12

https://senseis.xmp.net/?Joseki


#13

I really like Waltheri’s go pattern search