No idea. I really don’t know much about Greek personally, ancient or modern DX
I was thinking today about “voyage literature”, which is often poetic. Here are some examples.
Ὀδύσσεια (The Odyssey), Homer, 8th C. BCE
ἄνδρα μοι ἔννεπε, μοῦσα, πολύτροπον, ὃς μάλα πολλὰ
πλάγχθη, ἐπεὶ Τροίης ἱερὸν πτολίεθρον ἔπερσεν
πολλῶν δ᾽ ἀνθρώπων ἴδεν ἄστεα καὶ νόον ἔγνω,
πολλὰ δ᾽ ὅ γ᾽ ἐν πόντῳ πάθεν ἄλγεα ὃν κατὰ θυμόν,
ἀρνύμενος ἥν τε ψυχὴν καὶ νόστον ἑταίρων.
ἀλλ᾽ οὐδ᾽ ὣς ἑτάρους ἐρρύσατο, ἱέμενός περ:
αὐτῶν γὰρ σφετέρῃσιν ἀτασθαλίῃσιν ὄλοντο,
νήπιοι, οἳ κατὰ βοῦς Ὑπερίονος Ἠελίοιο
ἤσθιον: αὐτὰρ ὁ τοῖσιν ἀφείλετο νόστιμον ἦμαρ.
τῶν ἁμόθεν γε, θεά, θύγατερ Διός, εἰπὲ καὶ ἡμῖν.
Translation by G.A. Schomberg, 1879-82
(see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/English_translations_of_Homer)
Sing Muse the hero versatile, who roved
So far, so long, after he overthrew
Troy’s holy citadel ; of many men
He saw the cities, and their manners learned;
And woes he suffered on the deep; he strove
To win his comrades’ lives, and safe return.
But all his strivings failed to rescue them:
They perished for their witless sacrilege,
Who ate the oxen of Hyperion Sun;
Hence nevermore saw they their native land.
Daughter of Jove, help us to tell the tale.
Widsið, unknown poet, 6th-10th C. CE
(to be read A-B, A-B etc.)
| A | B |
|---|---|
| Widsið maðolade, | wordhord onleac, |
| se þe monna mæst | mægþa ofer eorþan, |
| folca geondferde; | oft he on flette geþah |
| mynelicne maþþum. | Him from Myrgingum |
| æþele onwocon. | He mid Ealhhilde, |
| fælre freoþuwebban, | forman siþe |
| Hreðcyninges | ham gesohte |
| eastan of Ongle, | Eormanrices, |
| wraþes wærlogan. | … |
| Swa ic geondferde fela | fremdra londa |
| geond ginne grund. | Godes ond yfles |
| þær ic cunnade | cnosle bidæled, |
| freomægum feor | folgade wide. |
| Forþon ic mæg singan | ond secgan spell, |
| mænan fore mengo | in meoduhealle |
| hu me cynegode | cystum dohten. |
Translation
Widsith spoke, unlocked his word-hoard,
he who had travelled most of all men
through tribes and nations across the earth.
Often he had gained great treasure in hall.
He belonged by birth to the Myrging tribe.
Along with Ealhild, the kind peace-weaver,
for the first time, from the Baltic coast,
he sought the home of Eormanric,
king of the Ostrogoths, hostile to traitors.
…
So I travelled widely through foreign lands,
through distant countries, and there I met
both good and bad fortune, far from my kin,
and served as a follower far and wide.
And so I can sing and tell a tale,
declare to the company in the mead-hall
how noble rulers rewarded me with gifts.
Rimini, Rudyard Kipling, early 20th C. (?)
When I left Rome for Lalage’s sake
By the Legions’ Road to Rimini,
She vowed her heart was mine to take
With me and my shield to Rimini –
(Till the Eagles flew from Rimini --)
And I’ve tramped Britain, and I’ve tramped Gaul,
And the Pontic shore where the snow-flakes fall
As white as the neck of Lalage –
(As cold as the heart of Lalage!)
And I’ve lost Britain, and I’ve lost Gaul,
And I’ve lost Rome and, worst of all,
I’ve lost Lalage!
The Song of Eärendil, J.R.R. Tolkien, pub. 1933
Eärendil was a mariner
that tarried in Arvernien;
he built a boat of timber felled
in Nimbrethil to journey in;
her sails he wove of silver fair,
of silver were her lanterns made,
her prow was fashioned like a swan,
and light upon her banners laid.
…
Beneath the Moon and under star
he wandered far from northern strands,
bewildered on enchanted ways
beyond the days of mortal lands.
From gnashing of the Narrow Ice
where shadow lies on frozen hills,
from nether heats and burning waste
he turned in haste, and roving still …
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I’ve tackled this topic before, so it’s nice to hear an advanced speaker give their take on the topic.
This is from ScorpioMartianus, Luke’s Latin channel.
It’s certainly well-founded what they have here, but I’m still sticking against better knowledge to German school pronounciation with my own additions ^^
I could imagine that implementing the Lucian pronounciation in classrooms will make it easier to access spoken modern Greek. I think these two guys have good arguments.
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These are macrons, they indicate vowel length. We don’t usually use them.
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Table from “They”: A Norse Word in English, Jackson Crawford https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tFAwyrKKM-Y
they is an interesting concept to implement in Latin.
In most sentences, it’s indicated by the use of a third-person plural verb conjugation.
They are baking bread. / Pánem coquunt.
There is also a word sé or sésé that means “themselves”.
They killed themselves. / Sé interfécére.
A meaning them (accusative) can be provided by several words, as I understand it.
hós, eós, quós m, m/f
hás, eás, quás f
The explicitly mixed-gender they, which Old Norse has in Þau, is a nifty feature (although it’s neuter, so perhaps it can mean those as well?)
I don’t know of any other languages which have this expression.
PS. it turns out that before triangle arrived from French, the English used the adjective þryscyte, which in Modern English we could render thriscite (/'θɹɪskaɪt/? /'θɹɪskət/? /'θɹɪsət/?).
The meat of the first video starts at the timestamp. The first ~4 mins explains how to find manuscript material online.
The third one could be a repost, but that’s how things get in a 1000+ thread.
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This is a poetic form. Regular 3.p. perfect has -érunt.
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Where do you get your quós and quás from? These are relative pronouns! You never ought to translate them as ‘them’, except maybe in what I call “Relativischer Satzanschluss”: Caesar pontes ficiendos curavit; quos nemo umquam delevit. “Caesar had bridges built; these nobody ever destroyed.”
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An interesting video reminiscent of my “1400 CE linguascape” post. It discusses any languages that might have come into contact with the Vikings and their language, Old Norse; including Germanic, Celtic, and Romance languages, and the tongues of the Middle East.
I also saw this one a while ago, about runic combinations (eg. for abbreviation):
See also
The Cotton or Cottonian library is a collection of manuscripts once owned by Sir Robert Bruce Cotton MP (1571–1631), an antiquarian and bibliophile … Cotton’s skill lay in finding, purchasing and preserving … ancient [monastic] documents.
The leading scholars of the era, including Francis Bacon, Walter Raleigh, and James Ussher came to use Sir Robert’s Library … The library is of special importance for sometimes having preserved the only copy of a work, such as happened with Beowulf
There are a lot of interesting texts on this page!
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I know I’ve posted on this topic before, but I was watching a certain Crawford video (Norse Months and Holidays) and I felt like discussing it again.
In Latin orthography, I’ve been moving towards the use of V /w/ and J /j/ (as in yellow).
It can be helpful for the consonants to be obvious to the modern reader, whilst understanding that this orthographic distinction wasn’t made in classical times.
Here are the names and meanings of the months in Latin, Old Norse, and traditional Japanese.
Interestingly, all three languages may have been briefly contemporaneous in the early Medieval period, ie. around 600 CE. This date is around the end of “living” Latin and the beginning of Old Norse, and a century or so before the start of Japanese-language records.
| English | Latin | Meaning | Norse | Meaning | Japanese (trad.) | Meaning |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| January | Jánuárius | mt. of Janus | Þorri | diminishment mt. | 睦月 Mutsuki | mt. of love |
| February | Februárius | mt. of offerings | Gói | snow mt. | 如月 Kisaragi | mt. of changing clothes |
| March | Mártius | mt. of Mars | Einmánuðr | lone mt. | 弥生 Yayoi | mt. of new life |
| April | Aprílis | mt. of “Venus” (?) | Gaukmánuðr | cuckoo mt. | 卯月 Uzuki | mt. of u-no-hana flowers |
| May | Május | mt. of Maia | Sáðtið | seed mt. | 皐月 Satsuki | mt. of rice-planting |
| June | Június | mt. of Juno | Sólmánuðr | sun mt. | 水無月 Minazuki | mt. of water |
| July | Július | mt. of Julius C. | Heyannir | hay-gathering mt. | 文月 Fumizuki | mt. of erudition |
| August | Augustus | mt. of Augustus | Kornskarð– | reaping mt. | 葉月 Hazuki | mt. of leaves |
| –armánuðr | ||||||
| September | September | seventh mt. | Haustmánuðr | harvest mt. | 長月 Nagatsuki | long mt. |
| October | Octóber | eighth mt. | Gormánuðr | gore mt. | 神無月 Kannazuki | mt. of gods |
| November | November | ninth mt. | Frermánuðr | frozen mt. | 霜月 Shimotsuki | mt. of frost |
| December | December | tenth mt. | Hrútmánuðr | rams mt. | 師走 Shiwasu | mt. of priests running |
* Latin month names are adjectives.
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Another edutainment video about words
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New video from WikiTongues
And here are direct links to a couple of useful playlists:
Old Norse Lessons / Pronunciation, Jackson Crawford How to Learn Old Norse (or Icelandic) - YouTube
91 Rules of Latin Grammar, latintutorial Introducing 91 Rules of Latin Grammar - YouTube
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This is a great-looking site which uses a combination of tools to make Vergil’s Aeneid accessible.
It was created by the guy behind the latintutorial channel.
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I am not really a fan of poetry, but I heard somewhere that today is the anniversary of the death of one of the greatest modern Greek poets, Kostas Varnalis, so I thought I’d bring you a poem here and translate it for you.
There are recitations of it, but I prefered to add a version with music in it, because well … let’s say that it is better that way and I like what Theodorakis and Bithikotsis did with the whole thing.
Here is the poem. As you might notice, it’s meaning is oddly “fresh” and contemporary in this day and age of the coronavirus, even if the imagery is from the past century. Or maybe it is just that every age has its problems and this poem is always going to be “in vogue” ( or διαχρονικό ).
Anyway, I am putting some links on the poem to help with the imagery of that age.
___Οι Μοιραίοι ______________________ Ruled by fate
Mες την υπόγεια την ταβέρνα, _______ Inside the underground tavern
μες σε καπνούς και σε βρισές ______ among smoke and profanity
(απάνω στρίγγλιζε η λατέρνα) ______ upstairs, the barrel organ was screetching
όλ’ η παρέα πίναμ’ εψές (2) ________ and with all the company, we were drinking yesterday
εψές, σαν όλα τα βραδάκια, _______ yesterday, just like every night
να πάνε κάτου τα φαρμάκια. _______ so that all the bitterness goes away
Σφιγγόταν ένας πλάι στον άλλο _____ Tight we were close to one another
και κάπου εφτυούσε καταγής. ______ and someone was spitting on the earth (with contempt)
Ω! πόσο βάσανο μεγάλο __________ O! how great a burden it is
το βάσανο είναι της ζωής! _________ the burden we call life
Όσο κι ο νους να τυραννιέται, ______ And as much as our mind struggles
άσπρην ημέρα δε θυμιέται. (3) _____ none of us can remember any good days
Ήλιε και θάλασσα γαλάζα ________ Sun and azure sea
και βάθος τ’ άσωτ’ ουρανού! ______ and the depths of the errant sky
Ω! της αυγής κροκάτη γάζα (1), ____ Ο! the dawns yolk colored band
γαρούφαλα του δειλινού, _________ and the carnations of the dusk
λάμπετε, σβήνετε μακριά μας, _____ you shine and blink, away from us
χωρίς να μπείτε στην καρδιά μας!___ without ever getting within our hearts
Tου ενού ο πατέρας χρόνια δέκα ___ One’s father has been for ten years
παράλυτος, ίδιο στοιχειό·__________ paralyzed, akin to a ghost
τ’ άλλου κοντόημερ’ η γυναίκα _____ another one’s wife had short days
στο σπίτι λυώνει από χτικιό·_______ now he is it at home, melting from sorrow
στο Παλαμήδι ο γιος του Mάζη _____ the son of Mazis is at Palamidi
κι η κόρη του Γιαβή στο Γκάζι. _____ the daughter of Giavi at Gazi (4)
― Φταίει το ζαβό το ριζικό μας! ____ It is our crooked destiny at fault!
― Φταίει ο Θεός που μας μισεί! ____It is God’s fault, who hates us!
― Φταίει το κεφάλι το κακό μας! ___It is our bad heads at fault!
― Φταίει πρώτ’ απ’ όλα το κρασί!___But most of all, it is the wine’s fault!
Ποιος φταίει; ποιος φταίει; Kανένα στόμα ____ Who is at fault? Who is at fault? No mouth
δεν το βρε και δεν το πε ακόμα. _____ has found it yet, no mouth has uttered it.
Έτσι στη σκοτεινή ταβέρνα ________ Thus, inside the dark tavern
πίνουμε πάντα μας σκυφτοί. _______ we always drink, hunched down
Σαν τα σκουλήκια, κάθε φτέρνα ____ Just like worms, every heel
όπου μας έβρει μας πατεί. ________ crushes us wherever it finds us
Δειλοί, μοιραίοι κι άβουλοι αντάμα, __ Cowards, ruled by fate and people without will, all together
προσμένουμε, ίσως, κάποιο θάμα! __ we expect, perhaps, some miracle!
As I said, I am not much of a poetry fan, but especially the imagery of the last verse is very well made and it hits home at any era in time.
(1) Someone wrote in the comments of that video, that this simile is actually from Homer that called the dawn “Κροκόπεπλος Ηώς”
(2) εψές = different form of the word εχθές = yesterday
(3) άσπρη μέρα means literally “white day”, but figuratively it means “a good day”
(4) Probably references of political persecutions of the time. The poet was a well-known communist and we did have a civil war at some point over that stuff, after all.
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New from Jackson Crawford
What is reindeer in your native or target language(s)?
Calepinus Novus gives the Latin word tarandus or tarandrus, -i, from Greek τάρανδος tarandos.
The scientific name is Rangifer, so rangifer, -eri is also an option.
We could also consider caribus, -i from French caribou.
A regular Latin deer is cervus, -i. There’s potential for various compounds, eg. gelicervus, a “frost deer”.
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The Icelandic Rune Poem, paraphrased from https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rune_poem#Example_(Icelandic_Rune_Poem)
This poem is fairly late as Norse literature goes, the oldest manuscript dating from the late 1400s.
Runes never became common in manuscript writing; that was done in the Roman alphabet. Runes were instead used for inscriptions, eg. on stone.
The language here is technically not Old Norse but Old Icelandic. Like other Norse poetry, it uses alliteration rather than rhyme. This poem was likely intended for mnemonic use (a memory aid).
Other examples of rune poems are found from Norway and England.
Note the order of the first six runes, which spell ᚠᚢᚦᚬᚱᚴ, futhark or futhorc, which gives us the modern name for the runes.
The typical alliterative structure in this poem is perhaps AA, A, BB but it’s very variable.
This variant of the Roman alphabet contains two characters which may be unfamiliar.
ð (capital Ð) is the eth. It has the same sound here that it has in IPA, which is the th in then.
þ (capital Þ) is the thorn. It has the sound /θ/, the th in thin.
The distinction between ð and þ in Medieval Germanic manuscripts doesn’t seem to have been entirely present; the separation of these two letters is often an editorial decision.
| Rune | Name | Old Icelandic | English |
|---|---|---|---|
| ’ | |||
| ᚠ | Fé | Fé er frænda róg | Wealth: the discord among kinsmen, |
| ok flæðar viti | the fire of the sea | ||
| ok grafseiðs gata. | and path of the serpent. | ||
| ’ | |||
| ᚢ | Úr | Úr er skýja grátr | Shower: the lamentation of the clouds, |
| ok skára þverrir | the ruin of the hay-harvest | ||
| ok hirðis hatr. | and woe of the shepherd. | ||
| ’ | |||
| ᚦ | Þurs | Þurs er kvenna kvöl | Giant: the torturer of women, |
| ok kletta búi | the cliff-dweller | ||
| ok varðrúnar verr | and husband of a giantess. | ||
| ’ | |||
| ᚬ | Óss | Óss er algingautr | God: aged Gautr, |
| ok ásgarðs jöfurr, | the prince of Asgard | ||
| ok valhallar vísi. | and lord of Valhalla. | ||
| ’ | |||
| ᚱ | Reið | Reið er sitjandi sæla | Riding: the joy of the horsemen, |
| ok snúðig ferð | the speedy journey | ||
| ok jórs erfiði. | and toil of the steed. | ||
| ’ | |||
| ᚴ | Kaun | Kaun er barna böl | Ulcer: the disease fatal to children, |
| ok bardaga [för] | the painful spot | ||
| ok holdfúa hús. | and abode of mortification. | ||
| ’ | |||
| ᚼ | Hagall | Hagall er kaldakorn | Hail: the cold grain, |
| ok krapadrífa | the shower of sleet | ||
| ok snáka sótt. | and sickness of serpents. | ||
| ’ | |||
| ᚾ | Nauð | Nauð er Þýjar þrá | Constraint: the grief of the bond-maid, |
| ok þungr kostr | the state of oppression | ||
| ok vássamlig verk. | and toilsome work. | ||
| ’ | |||
| ᛁ | Íss | Íss er árbörkr | Ice: the bark of the rivers, |
| ok unnar þak | the roof of the wave | ||
| ok feigra manna fár. | and destruction of the doomed. | ||
| ’ | |||
| ᛅ | Ár | Ár er gumna góði | Plenty: the boon to men, |
| ok gott sumar | the good summer | ||
| algróinn akr. | and thriving crops. | ||
| ’ | |||
| ᛋ | Sól | Sól er skýja skjöldr | Sun: the shield of the clouds, |
| ok skínandi röðull | the shining ray | ||
| ok ísa aldrtregi. | and destroyer of ice. | ||
| ’ | |||
| ᛏ | Týr | Týr er einhendr áss | Tyr: the god with one hand, |
| ok ulfs leifar | the leavings of the wolf | ||
| ok hofa hilmir. | and the prince of temples. | ||
| ’ | |||
| ᛒ | Bjarkan | Bjarkan er laufgat lim | Birch: the leafy twig, |
| ok lítit tré | the little tree | ||
| ok ungsamligr viðr. | and fresh young shrub. | ||
| ’ | |||
| ᛘ | Maðr | Maðr er manns gaman | Man: the delight of man, |
| ok moldar auki | the augmentation of earth | ||
| ok skipa skreytir. | and adorner of ships. | ||
| ’ | |||
| ᛚ | Lögr | Lögr er vellanda vatn | Water: the eddying stream, |
| ok viðr ketill | the broad geyser | ||
| ok glömmungr grund. | and land of the fish. | ||
| ’ | |||
| ᛦ | Ýr | Ýr er bendr bogi | Yew: the bent bow, |
| ok brotgjarnt járn | the brittle iron | ||
| ok fífu fárbauti. | and giant of the arrow. |
I googled kanji as you do and I found an artist who draws kanji in a form of what they represent. You need to really squint your eyes to see the original kanji behind the drawings here.
Animals are my favorite but you can find other pictures there too.
I’m gonna hide it behind the link so it doesn’t take as much space but I recommend clicking it even if you aren’t interested in Japanese: https://twitter.com/bsmky2kanjist/status/550242844024127490
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people in form of kanji:
人
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