Leela Zero + Sabaki had really transformed into a fantastic analyzing tool!


#1

When I discovered Leela Zero, it was eye opening. It’s not proprietary, it’s not charging any fee, and it’s mighty strong. It’s like Sai in Hikaru no Go only in that it does not teach, only tells you a cold number - winrate percentage.

But for a long time, there’s no good interface for analyzing games.

Lizzie was good but I always find it not quite user friendly. Like when I hover mouse over the best move, the variation appears but keeps changing and I have to pause the “pondering” for it to stabilize in there. And I cannot save the variation. And there’s no command line telling me what LZ is doing or thinking. And the move tree is always confusing as it appears to be not moving and I do not know which move I am at. etc etc.

I have been using Sabaki to write sgf and edit sgf and it’s been great. The navigation tree is very very clear. However it lacks realtime analysis like Lizzie so I have been using both… Until recently…

the most recent Leela zero release adds analysis features, like lz-genmove_analyze, and Thank You yichuanshen! the author of Sabaki responded very quickly and added a lot of useful tools into Sabaki. It suddenly become a much better analyzing tool together with Leela zero. It can show better moves just like Lizzie and it can save those variations. And it could save out all the edits, winrates, variations, etc onto a new sgf but the realtime analysis alone is good enough for all I wanted and needed.

It took him three releases to get the things he wanted 0.40.0 -> 0.40.1 -> 0.41.0 but he did so quickly and so wonderfully. I don’t know him and don’t know if he reads posts here but again Thank You!

I really think Leela Zero has helped me a lot and I am glad I discovered this combo. I strongly recommend trying them and kudos to both writers!

(BTW, I run the 192 weight against 157 weight today and both times 157 won as black. And it wins in the late mid game when 192 has blunders. My PC is relatively good with E7 64GB RAM and 1080 GTX. Very weird.)


#2

Thanks for sharing @ksnqx. Are there specific instructions to get the right combo on Windows?

What I liked about Lizzie was how easy it was to install. And it always pulls the latest LZ version!


#3

It may look intimidating first as there are all those -g -w -d -m parameters but what you really needed is to download Sabaki installation file - an exe - for windows x64, install it. Download Leela Zero - the exactly same folder called “leela zero” that appears in the latest Lizzie 0.6 release, so you could use that folder too. And in Sabaki manage engine section, write in the link to leelaz.exe and some initial settings like weight file, playout limits, time management etc, and that’s it. It’s actually pretty fun looking into all the parameters and know what they do exactly.



#4

FYI, I just found this:
https://deepleela.com/

“Review SGF” option there allows us to get heatmap and winrate without installing anything.


#5

seems to be what i was looking for in the other thread.
but after i imported the sgf, i can’t get the “analyze” to function. what button should i click?

and “challenge AI” and “free practice” looks the same to me. whats the difference?


#6

Import not the file but the content of sgf by opening your sgf file with a text editor, copy all the lines, paste it onto the SGF window that appears after selecting “Review SGF”.

You can navigate to whatever move number by using the arrow buttons accessible through the 3 dots on lower right. Then hitting the AI button there gives you the heatmap and winrate for the next move. Placing the pointer on one of the candidate positions gives you the most likely sequence for several moves.

If the importing does not work, it probably is an incompatible format. Use your text editor to make your sgf compatible by looking at what’s displayed after selecting “Export SGF” (Export data becomes available after playing several moves against the LZ on the site). Compare the format with what’s on your sgf file, remove the sgf elements not on the export window (leaving your move data in) and try importing it.

I don’t know what’s the difference between challenge and practice.


#7


#8

yep, it works today, but for some reason i got stuck up to this part yesterday. copied the text sgf and i can see my moves but analysing doesn’t start. but it’s OK now. funny.


#9

Blockquote
And it could save out all the edits, winrates, variations, etc onto a new sgf but the realtime analysis alone is good enough for all I wanted and needed.

Do you mean it would be nice if it did that, but it still doesn’t? I’m trying to figure out whether I can do that with Sabaki + LeelaZero. Any hints would be highly appreciated.


#10

Thanks again for sharing.

I gave it a try but moved back to Lizzie. Maybe I missed something, but here are two things I like better with Lizzie:

  • clear indication of the actual next move in a game analysis.
  • clear indication on the analysis state (on/off).

What I also found confusing with Sabaki, although not a big deal, was that I had to replace a player with AI to trigger an analysis.