Vibe-coded features in less than a week and somehow having a better UX, sounds as likely a combination as “burning coal and out-running an electric car”. Using such an imaginary scenario is hardly going to prod (no pun intended) anyone into action.
But let’s say that it happens.
What’s the problem? I do not see it. 
It is not as if any of us has “OGS stocks” or something… if such a better server can be made and someone does make it, that would be actually pretty cool.
sure. but a successful server must be good enough for many users besides yourself - otherwise the network effect kills it. It’s possible that some small subset of functionality is enough to satisfy some large group, but intuition tells me that you need core functionality (play games) plus a smattering of other features (tournaments, tsumego, tutorials)
jeth, non profit is not just a term, it is a legally defined entity. That some Foreign aid is less effective due to corruption around some NGOs is irrelevant to the topic of OSG and volunteering to improve it. Public oversight on non profits is stronger then on companies by definition, Non profits have to meet all the standards that private companies must, and then some. But this is irrelevant to the topic in hand so I shall bow out as I have no desire to debate objectivism in this forum. I bid thee good day. 
We’d had “non profits” in my country (Greece) that promoted “the transfer of know-how of tomato cultivation to Cote D’Ivoire”. I am sure it was all legal and much tomato knowledge was passed from Greece to Cote D’Ivoire and the EU funds were “well spent”, for sure. 
Of course it is legally defined.
And of course all this money is rolling around legally because that legal definition allows for so many types of monetary gains for the people involved you couldn’t imagine. They just cannot be called “profits”…
Also non-profits are often tax-exempt in the EU:
Which is why there are some allegations for someone in the area I live who instead of opening up a gym and having people paying memberships and paying taxes, he opened a “non-profit for the improvement of local health” and turned the gym members in to “Non-profit donors”, so now those people pay less money for going to the gym and the owner pays no taxes for that revenue.
Also, the allegations say that the building where the gym operates is owned by a relative of theirs and they probably take subsidy money from the state/EU to pay for the rent, so they also get free rent, their relatives pocket that money, they operate their gym legally and noone pays taxes.
Everything is legal, yet the money is flowing. Public oversight indeed… 
I had to google that:
I still do not know what on earth you are talking about.
It’s not imaginary at all. You underestimate the capabilities of AI. You just need someone with some skills in design using it.
As I said, in this case then we all get a better Go server, with similar features and better UI/UX.
If someone wants to make that, I see no problem with that.
If that happens and it raises the bar of competition, that’s a great thing, not something to worry about.
But will it?
Let’s wait and see. 
Yes, I for one am very curious. It will really show how hard or easy it is to build a Go Server from scratch.
I mean it also seems to be a one man team but maybe even better positioned than OGS is.
He has got the credentials and he has been working on this since more than a year.
I think other than this effort the only real competition OGS has is either the Asian giants “moving” but that doesn’t seem to happen currently.
Or someone skilled attaching a FE to an existing server. Like a WeiqiHub or Libaduk kind of thing.
If you are a pretty good software engineer you could certainly create something between a proof of concept and an alpha release in a few weeks or a month.
But I think you very much overestimate the (current) capabilities of AI and underestimate how much stuff you need to get to work well if you think you can “vibe code” a go server in a week, in a month or even in a year.
I predict in 4 days you’ll be so frustrated about arguing with Claude about it storing your game state as string fields containing SGF in a sqlite server (that it keeps wiping whenever it changes data formats), that you’ll give up.
Yep, and I don’t see why the FE must be browser based. Sure, it’s nice but not essential.
If it’s a sexy front end people want, there are already several of these - from what I gather OGS are very accommodating when third party devs want to hook into their server. The first two that come to mind are Just Go and whatever Minaaro uses (I forget the app name).
A while back, the hot topic was “how do we deal with sandbaggers?”. At another time, it was “what’s going on with ranks?”. There’ll always be multiple fronts that could be progressed - I am certain that the people with skin in the game try to make the best choice for maximum overall effect.
The patient and calm posts by @GreenAsJade are commendable.
Why is that? I mean, it should be able to be done in a week, right? 
It’s true that you also need some experience in software development, and experience using Claude. Indeed enough to have learned not to let it make important backend architecture decisions like how to store game state. I happen to have run into that fairly recently, when I vibe coded this chess variant and committed to not writing a single line of code.
Documented it here (specifically this post deals with the database issue). It goes off the rails a little when I start trying to train a neural network to play the game, but before that I was able to implement a boatload of features in about 15 hours, even including details like persistent game states on server restarts and a basic minimax analysis engine.
Of course I spent no time at all on UI design, creating assets etc. That’s where the majority of your time would be spent if you want to make a competing go server. For just the basics, that shouldn’t take more than a week. In any case, if I know one thing it’s that programming is not the bottleneck.
It’s not a problem for you and I necessarily, but it’s a problem for OGS of course. And as a long time user I am a little invested in its success.
But you think for developing OGS the bottleneck in the past would have been “programming”?
Yes, of course. There are probably thousands of hours of people writing and looking at code in OGS at this point. The example project I linked earlier would have taken me at least 10 times as many hours to build without AI.
I can’t recall the last line of code I wrote for OGS either - I think the same is true for anoek.
And yet … running a longstanding server with thousands of users and high uptime somehow still keeps us busy.
Perhaps not something you’re familiar with?
Hilarious arrogance here. Quite remarkable. Said with all earnestness too, it seems! 
I’m gobmacked, really 
“I can write a server in a day with vibe coding, but these OGS dummies are for sure back in the dark ages writing code”. 
You do know that the people you’re talking about are right here in the room with you, right?
I guess that’s good: being rude to our face is perhaps better than being rude behind our backs
I’ve worked in the industry for 15 years, so yes I’m familiar. Not sure how that’s relevant.
Hilarious arrogance here. Quite remarkable. Said with all earnestness too, it seems!
I’m gobmacked, really
“I can write a server in a day with vibe coding, but these OGS dummies are for sure back in the dark ages writing code”.
You do know that the people you’re talking about are right here in the room with you, right?
I guess that’s good: being rude to our face is perhaps better than being rude behind our backs
It’s interesting that you took it that way. As if I’m somehow unaware that OGS has existed for many years, and the vast majority of it was written before AI could be leveraged for programming.
Are you saying there’s not thousands of hours in it at this point? If so, I applaud the devs’ productivity. I certainly could not have done it in less than 1000 hours, but then again I have little experience in frontend work.
I realize I’ve been controversial here, but your tone is unbecoming of staff.
LOL “staff”?
I keep trying to explain what the situation is at OGS, people who should know better (15 years in the industry) keep failing to listen.
OGS is a one-person project, with a volunteer “team” supporting.
What is this “staff” thing?
What obligations are there on me because I volunteer here that aren’t on anyone?
I would have thought the obligation goes in the other direction - a modicum of respect for what we have here and for the folk actually contributing.
Your own contributions to the discussion have been measured and polite, and yet coming from a position of “this could all be so much better, so easily …” which be-littles what is here already.
And you talk about “OGS” as if the group of people you’re talking about is at arms length, rather than right here with you.
I’ve read and re-read the thread and I can’t make out what your actual point has been.
We’ve all been politely engaged, but reducing the type of work we do to “can be replaced by a week of vibe coding” is just rude.
It annoys me
So - yeah - some tone eventually emerges 
I really don’t want to belabor this point, but given your response I suppose it needs explanation. “Staff” is the wrong word, that’s my bad, but when you respond to the OP with “We know” and many of your responses are from the perspective of the OGS dev team, readers will think you are representing OGS. To an extent, what you say can be interpreted as OGS’ official position. That’s not necessarily valid, but it’s at least more likely to happen. In my opinion, that means you have more of a responsibility to be measured in your responses. But you can do what you want, of course. I personally don’t mind a jab here and there, I’ve been in the trenches.
I would have thought the obligation goes in the other direction - a modicum of respect for what we have here and for the folk actually contributing.
I respect all contributors to OGS a great deal. I’m posting in this thread because, as I said, I’m (emotionally) invested in OGS and want it to succeed.
Your own contributions to the discussion have been measured and polite, and yet coming from a position of “this could all be so much better, so easily …” which be-littles what is here already.
And you talk about “OGS” as if the group of people you’re talking about is at arms length, rather than right here with you.
I’ve read and re-read the thread and I can’t make out what your actual point has been.
We’ve all been politely engaged, but reducing the type of work we do to “can be replaced by a week of vibe coding” is just rude.
Hmm, that’s really not what I’ve been saying at all, but if that’s how you read it, that’s probably my fault. I don’t think it’s constructive for me to go back and explain every point I’ve made. Maybe just the latest:
What I’m saying is that it would no longer take hundreds of hours to build a platform with enough basic features (please note that I don’t mean ALL features currently in OGS) to compete with OGS as the go-to web-based go server. If a new competitor’s UX is much better, that could be problematic for OGS’ future. It’s not easy to build such a competitor, but it is much easier than it was 5 years ago, and the odds of someone doing it successfully have greatly increased. This does not minimize what it took to get OGS to where it is currently. I have never and would never pretend that OGS as it stands hasn’t been a major and impressive effort by its owner and contributors.
Currently, OGS is by far the best option for playing go in a browser, which is all that probably >90% of users use the site for. Are we confident it will still be in a year or two? If not, that can be an argument for reprioritizing a UI/UX redesign in order to stay ahead of the competition. The context, in case you don’t remember, was a discussion about how highly this should be prioritized.
I agree with everything you’ve written above ^^ (both sections).
Thanks for clarifying calmly.
Why didn’t CGS have more of an impact?
It’s almost exactly what you “forecast”, there already. A basic easy to access web based Go server with gorgeous graphics…
It’s a good question. I was one of CGS’ early adopters and helped beta test it because I thought it was promising, particularly for newer players. I think it suffered mostly from two main problems:
