These are 4 necessary conditions to become an expert. However they are not sufficient, many people meet these requirements and yet fail to become an expert (if by expert you mean pro level, i.e. proficient enough to make a living from that skill).
I am not sure if the video claimed that those four are all that is needed (which would have been a dubious claim) or just that they are definitely needed (which is much more sensible for the vast majority of cases, barring extreme cases of amazing genius), but I will agree that depending on each particular thing much more or much less might be needed.
For example if you want to be an expert olive tree trimmer, you hardly need all those four things for so many hours. You could become “a pro” in a couple of tree-trimming seasons. However if you want to become an expert in traditional japanese carpentry, it might take you twenty years to get those intricate joints correctly.
I think that the main merit of this video was compiling that list and explaining some of the intricacies of those matters because a lot of times people ask here or elsewhere “how can I improve in Go?” and most of us haven’t really given a lot of thought in compiling a list or even explaining it properly.
For people who didn’t watch the video, I quote from a comment:
The four things are
- Valid environment (chess is valid, roulette is random)
- Many repetitions (predicting election results is hard as they are rare events with low repetitions vs. tennis shots)
- Timely feedback (anesthesiologist gets instant feedback vs. radiologist gets delayed feedback)
- Deliberate practice (practice at the edge of your comfort zone, identify weakness and work on it)
so we say things like “solve tsumego” or “read books” or “watch videos” or “consult a teacher” or “lose 100 games and do reviews” which are all in the ballpark of that list, but lack the structure of the list itself, since we never really explain the rationale behind those.
Also the point that practice and games should be “on the edge” is something that most of us know instinctively/practically, but we rarely articulate it when we give advice, so it is a bit obvious, but profound at the same time in the “oh, I had forgotten about that” kind of way.
All in all though, I’ll be honest, if you told me to add a fifth thing in the list, I am not sure that I can actually do it.
@yebellz that was awesome and it made me smile. I found this in the comments of that link:
now if YouTube had those kinds of ads, noone would have been using AdBlockers
I don’t think that a 5th item is needed, it’s just that the 4 items are quite vague and lack details. For instance I may practice thousands of tsumegos (points 1 and 2), check the solution immediately (point 3) and then? What is deliberate practice? Do I understand why I got it wrong? Is there something that I should understand or is it that I just need more practice? Do I have wrong “solving habits”?
Improving in games is even harder. Most of us don’t know what to work on.
(That said I have several unread books on my shelf that will keep me busy for a few months.)
You are right, but that is why this is the “thought-provoking videos” and not the “problem solved lectures”
Jokes aside this is a very hard issue to tackle, here is a relevant lecture from the 2013 USA Go Congress:
There are very interesting things said, analysed and mentioned there, yet, still, the problem can be said to remain largely open still. That’s why they held a “Teacher’s Workshop” after all.
I’ve solved less than 100 tsumego in my life, so I do not think that I qualify to have an opinion on that exact example. I am not evading your observation, I just do not know. The only thing I can tell is that I deliberately steered away from the hardest of them for three reasons:
a) I prefered to see/find those problems in real games where my mind was engaged and fail at them. Failing at a real problem in a real game makes me remember/learn from it more.
b) The more difficult tsumego were so artificial that I found them detrimental to even ponder. Some weird stuff and moves that no sane person would have played seemed to have created the original board of those tsumego. That generated a “why am I doing this?” feeling that made me disconnect from the problem, even if the solution was interesting.
c) The solutions sometimes were odd, especially when the goal is vague and you do not know if you are out to make the group live or the best you can have is a ko.
I’ve left a post in the middle about my deficiencies and things to improve at Go, I will probably finish it at night.
I think that after a certain level where we start understanding the game, our skill in noticing our deficiency rises (iirc it is part of the Dunning-Krueger effect, but on its other side. The more competent you are at something the better you become at spotting your mistakes and errors) and the more we learn, the more possibilities open (e.g. more invasions, better defenses, interesting tesuji, the existence of Sabaki as a concept and practice etc.).
Sometimes it might be hard to spot what exactly is the issue, so you can just learn more about Go and the specific issue of interest will either be spotted or you will just get generally/overall better.
The current rule is that I have to retire between 64 and 70. I don’t know yet when I’ll retire, I guess it depends on whether I need money to help other family members, or whether I have grandchildren… It’s still too early to decide.
Yeah, “retirement stuff” is apparently a whole market over there in the States. Over here in Europe most people just wait until they are around the legal age to retire and that’s it. Plus for the vast majority of people it is not even possible to do so, exactly for the reasons you mentioned (too many things are fluid in terms of family and work).
Of what I understand, over there in a lot of urban States there is a great stigma on people that stay with, or even around their parents, both in the actual social culture and in the “popular culture” like movies, trends, social media etc. We’ve all seen some kind of movie or concept of the “total loser” who is mucking about in their parent’s house basement and it is always viewed/presented as the lowest form of decadence.
So, if your children are geared towards moving away - sometimes even in a totally different state - then if you had a family at a normal age (between 25-35) and your kids are out by 18, then you might be around 45-55 with no obligations anymore (and reasonably any morgage/loan you took when you where young is now repaid). At that point, I’d say that it is very reasonable to switch gears and start thinking about having some rest and retiring. So, since the target group is so much larger over there, it makes sense that there is such a market for “gurus” or “advice” on the matter.
Speaking of which, and since we are in the “thought-provoking” topic, does anyone have any insight on the “paying rent to your parents” thing? It is a very alien concept here, so I am having some trouble understanding the idea of paying your own family. Why do that? What’s the point?
Things may be changing slowly in the US
The situation in Europe is not homogeneous at all.
Rich European countries tend to be similar to the US.
I wonder how much of the difference between northwest Europe and south/east Europe is cultural. For example, I have this image of Italian families traditionally living with more than 2 generations in one house, but I don’t know how accurate that image is today (and if it is, whether the motivation is tradition, or financial, both, and/or something else).
I am not sure what to make of that to be honest. On the one hand I consider it a good idea, on the other hand I know that most of them view it as a last resort and it is probably done out of necessity, so it is a bit of a conflict there.
True, the end result as a percentage might be similar, but there are significant differences.
If I remember correctly in places like Germany and the Scandinavian countries the new adults get some subsidy so that they can afford to move out and there is a sufficient social and legal network that is geared towards helping them improve their skills and find jobs. Plus the college tuitions are much more reasonable and affordable (exorbitant student debt is mostly a USA thing) and when the kids do move out, European countries are more “compact” so to say. Kids might have moved out, but they are still practically nearby, even if they are living in another country (1), so families are much more keen to help out and keep in touch. If I understand things correctly, unlike the urban USA social stigma that “you have to do it or you are a loser”, in Northern Europe the idea is that “it can be done, it is a reasonable thing, it is well organised, so let’s go for it” (while in Southern Europe in most cases it is not only financially impossible, but it is an unorganised mess, as well. It can be argued that most people never really retire over here). So, there is still a bigger sense of a family unit, so people are more keen to think like you do and want to help their children and grandchildren, instead of closing shop early and retiring.
(1) Fun fact, last week someone was trying to reach Athens from a nearby village, so he could travel to Germany. The 180 km mountain trip to Athens took him longer than getting to Germany.
Considering that we are a very similar culture I can say that this is still a valid cultural idea. E.g. even now if you have the money to build a house and move out of renting, parents do not plan a house for just their family, but they plan it for “the future family” and tend to make a house for them and an apartment for each of their children, when they can afford it, of course.
The idea of a close knit family is still very much alive and it has a lot of merits, especially in unorganised places where you have to rely more on close relatives, than the state (here is where tradition/culture merges with the financial/government stuff).
In France many students, especially under 20 years old, still live with their parents because housing prices are so high, or just because it’s more convenient. Older adtuls generally live on their own. We had a movie, “Tanguy” about a 28 year-old guy who still lives with his parents and doesn’t want to move out, while his parents consider him as a parasite and try hard to kick him out.
It’s not that people forget family links either. Several of my acquaintances took care of their elderly parents who needed assistance for everyday life (eating, getting dressed, etc.)
A tiny bit “langweilig” the first minutes for something which is supposed to be “kurtz gesagt”
It is still sadly accurate:
I like how people in the comments keep adding “Zen riddles” like:
“In order to increase chances of job, one should apply in person and meet with manager. Only to be told by manager to go home and apply online.” which is exactly what happened to a friend of mine that is looking for a job in Athens right now. What an odd time to be alive.
One of the most frustrating experience of today’s way of life i share with your friend.