Point counting in "Learn" section (3.19 Territory, question 10)

Greetings.

I’ve been tackling go again quite recently and I’m solving the (incredibly well done) quizzes of the Learn section. Things seem to be going well so far. However I stumbled on this question:

According to the quiz, the correct answer is 2, but I don’t understand why. To me, bottom left corner (A1) and B2 clearly belong to white. I’m only hesitating a little for C1, but I would have said that’s a white territory.

What am I missing?

C1 is a false eye. It is also part of a ko (back and forth captures). If White wins the ko, she will have to fill in C1. If Black wins the ko, he will occupy C1 and fill in D1.

I see! Now, is it correct to state that false eyes are never counted as part of any player’s territory?

Yes, I think so, with one caveat: the cutting stone itself may become surrounded and captured, in which case the false eye, strictly speaking, no longer exists, and the enclosed space is territory.

C1 will never be a point, white will have to save his stone D1 so will have to connect it by playing in C1 or black will be able to capture D1 by playing C1.

All this alternating captures may finally have to follow the rule of ko, which I invite you to check on Sensei Library the go wiki.

That just repeats what I already said. The OP’s follow-up question was not about C1 specifically, but whether false eyes (i.e., in general) are never counted. My nuanced answer was correct, I believe.

never is a bit strong, see Two-Headed Dragon at Sensei's Library, but those are incredibly rare. Some might also say those aren’t false eyes, once connected around to each other.

Thanks for your respective replies :slight_smile: Each of them brings something new to my original question.

The two-headed dragon situation is quite interesting! Thanks for the link.

My original goal was to better understand point counting so I’ll keep focusing on that aspect of the question for the following reasons: I already knew about the ko rules but my tsumego training and the pages you’ve linked me to make me realize that ko seems to be a huge topic on itself! I’m gonna need more time to understand how kos influence gameplay.

Regarding counting, it seems that either a ko can be solved (= removed?) if the right player plays it, but it also seems there are situations where neither player might want to (because solving it might indirectly cost points). I guess that in such a case, everything is fine as long as both players agree that the intersection belongs to no-one?

So a dead stone only counts for two point if after you capture it, you also get the territory underneath as a point.

Black can’t do that here though.

White gets a maximum of 2 points, but sometimes black gains one extra point if they capture the stone in Atari and then connect afterward.

So the simple way of counting more like 1.5 points to white (only counting the white area), like an average between 2 and 1 points for white.

A more accurate answer involves thirds of a point.

Not really
The concept of fake/true eye should be of limited use for life and death only if you want my own perspective. Here this is just confusing as white has already two eyes somewhere else. The question is not about eyes.