I feel that when black resists white’s attachment, he will just be helping white to strengthen the upper side moyo.
So I would give white as little help as possible and just extend to R11.
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If black plays R11, white certainly have no reason to play locally. And then if white plays N7, what would black play next?
No matter how big the bottom side is for black, the center is even bigger, for white to gain influence toward the center combined with an upper side moyo, and a lowe left moyo, I don’t think black can compete with all that, and it would be very busy to deal with all three. It might be too late when white gets stronger and stronger on the outside.
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Never say certainly. White may still have local shenanigans with S9.
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I remember I asked the exact same question before…
Still, not sure about the answer. Do black have to answer S10?
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It’s an open question I don’t know the answer to. Black “certainly” wants to play elsewhere if possible.
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If black calmly extends to R11, something like this could happen (diagram 1):
If black resists with the outer hane, something like this could happen (diagram 2):
That is similar to the first diagram, but slightly worse for black IMO. If black cuts at P12 now, white may atari on the outside (O12) to expand the center potential, or perhaps even tenuki and invade at K3.
If instead, black resists with a hane on the inside, something like this could happen (diagram 3):
Black plays it to gain sente to reduce white’s moyo, at the expence of making white stronger on the right side, making the reduction of the upper side more dangerous for black and attacking white in the lower right has become more difficult for black when his right side group has defects.
As black, I’m OK with white getting K14, as long as black still has K6, because the game would still be balanced territorially.
Fighting as in the 3rd diagram is possible. But fighting is risky when it’s not neccessary to keep the game balanced.
So I would be choosing between the first 2 diagrams.
Of those, I prefer diagram 1, because it gives white least help in the center, so black can just play the big (30+ points) move at K6 after white K14 (perhaps after exchanging C18-D18) and black can look forward to attacking white in the lower right and/or lower left. White will still be busy, so to me that feels like a comfortable game for black.
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I think we also need to take into account the white group below. How weak is it?
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This is all based on the assumption white would want to gote and settle instead of using the sente.
The first variation, I don’t feel it is necessary for white to play R13 after black played R11, it only helps black reinforcing the upper right. White can just play say S9, or N7, even start invasion inside the bottom black moyo (it’s far too open and easy to live inside, or just reduction and jump out).
The second variation, white don’t have to hane at P11, but can clamp at Q10. If black connects with R11, white then can play S9, and the lower right white group is basically alive.
The third variation, black Q11 is also helping white to effectively make a strong group and effectively a strong wall. AFter black K16, white can then play R13 as a forcing move, to connect the group, and then start sealing in the K16 on top with K14. And I am not that confident black can live inside, and escaping might just help white to gain massive influence in the center (most likely turned into semeai or ko).
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Are you saying that black R11, black Q11 and black Q13 are all bad for black? Or are only black Q13 and the white follow-ups in my first two diagrams wrong?
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I don’t see a great value of white N7. What is its purpose? Why would black feel a need to even respond to that move?
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I prefer Q13 if I would to choose amount them, with different sequence bQ13 wP13 bQ14. And if white then play N7, black can push out with P14, and break the Q12 moyo move (those two white stones will no longer be connected to the top), and secure the upper right black group to live
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because the two black stone is weak and is at risky of being cut off if white get the chance to play O5. If black doesn’t respond and play somewhere else when N7 played, black will be forced to extend to respond to O5, and then white can go back to deal with whatever black played, or use the sente for something else. Like extending with M7, effectively make the lower right white group escape, build influence toward the center. Any move black tried to seal off the bottom side as territory, white can just pile on top to make influence toward the center stronger.
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Wait. Are you saying that white will ignore 3 and play at B, allowing black A? That doesn’t make sense to me.
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Wouldn’t black always extend in response to white O5, regardles if there is a white stone at N7? I’m sorry, but I don’t get it. Why would this be wrong for black?
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You asked what would be my take on the right sequence, this is the sequence I imagine, instead of your variations 3. And I specifically said this is what white “cannot” play away, because black can punish with P14, if white plays N7.
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Next move is white’s
What would black to play? try to live in the center for K16? Not impossible, but would be a fight, and not an easy one. if black has any slack, and give white the chance to play M7, it would be pretty bad…
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Allright. Apparently I misinterpreted your comment.
Just to clarify: do you think this is the best continuation for black and white?
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Probably the safest and solid for black, but haven’t tried other possible variations for white yet. And the lower right white group is still in danger.
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Something like this?
I still wouldn’t mind playing with black. But it’s still early to say if the game is favouring either player, I feel.
Maybe it’s a matter of taste about what type of game one prefers to play. A calm player might prefer black’s territorial prospects, while an aggressive player might prefer white’s attacking prospects.
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Good interesting comments between you too. Maybe some other views from our pool of players? Or some comments on the comments?
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