Upgrade Priority: Backup and Downloading

Since data security and backup does not seem to be a priority, I kindly ask the developers to first establish the possibility to download one’s own games and send a message that this is done and leave some time to do so before doing anything else.

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Hello @wulfenia

Was it a priority for you ? The release date was known, you were able to download them before but ironically it seems that you haven’t enjoyed that opportunity for doing so, or am I wrong ?

I don’t ask for your answer anyway, I don’t mean to offend you neither. When it’s not a priority, you postpone it, when it’s not the biggest priority, you may also postpone it (GTD method and so) and when it’s the priority number one, you can fail in honouring it, as you already said, everyone can make mistakes or simply face with never seen or complex situations.

But, unless you’re really sure data security and backup were the lowest priority and it sounds so when you write “does not seem to be”, you should not write the way you did. In my humble opinion, it sounds a bit scornful and I don’t think it’s appropriate in the context.




Are you serious? Obviously, I trusted the devs here to make a backup before doing the upgrade. Incidentally, I have downloaded my games before but they were lost because I wrongly trusted someone else as well. But thanks so much to point out that it is my own fault to trust anyone because you think that trusting someone is so absurd that it is “ironical”.

This is exactly the kind of behaviour I dislike. You ask me a question, me, personally. And then you add that “you don’t ask for my answer”. Which means that you are not interested in what I say but simply wanted to make the point to everyone else that it is somehow my fault if all data is lost on ogs. And you don’t want me to answer because then you might have to support this implication. It is this kind of passive-aggressive arguing I dislike. Ask me a question or don’t ask me a question, but do not ask me a question and then say that you didn’t.

So far, you didn’t, but this sentence is another example of passive-aggressive behaviour, because if you did offend me, adding that you “don’t mean to” just serves as a self-immunisation not to be held responsible for it. Say what you want to say and then take responsibility for it, not saying right away that your are not responsible for the effect of what you say.

You know very well that the context is a post by trohde and the reactions and more importantly non-reactions by everyone else coupled with the fact that I cannot download my games while everyone thinks that comments like trohde’s are perfectly fine. So do not pretend that you do not know this context.

And again, saying that your opinion is “humble” does not make it so. I dislike this passive-aggressive style a lot.

Oh, and of course, my post cannot be scornful because I did not mean it to be, so how can it be scornful? Or did you mean that it only applies to you that it does not matter at all how things sound to other people?

Judging an attitude of a community member, be it passive-agressive or whichever of the range of attitudes, is playing on the person. Please criticize ideas, not people.

And then say you didn’t? No, that was not the case, ‘and then say you do not want to hear my answer’ was the case.
Being asked a question does not always imply you should share the answer with the one who voices the question, some questions are just to guide your thinking in a helpful way to an insight that you missed, or are at least meant to have that effect. The ways of language are manifold.
Could it be that you are aware of this helpfulness? :wink:

Dear @Wulfenia,

You “trusted” OGS to be your personal SGF archive? I am not aware that they even advertised this service anywhere (also see the first paragraph of the OGS Terms of Service). The way you phrase it makes it sound like a personal wrong has been done to you.

You might have used OGS as your games archive, like one might use facebook or Twitter as a blog to remember one’s expression, thoughts and feelings, or use YouTube as an archive of one’s published videos, because it is convenient in that role.

But posts disappear from facebook, videos disappear from YouTube, even dedicated blogging platforms (arguably “storage” services) shut down, and afterwards people are always baffled about losing data.
You have been using a tool unfit for your purpose.

As a rule of thumb, if your data is not on your device (hard disk, mobile phone, physical photo), it does not belong to you and it is not under your control. If your data is on someone else’s computer, the owner of that computer has control over your data.

This is a life lesson similar to the first time you have to pay any late fee. It might come as a surprise and an annoyance that you have to pay money (the amount of which is often dictated by the receiving party) for nothing but the fact that you missed some inconvenient deadline, just like it can be surprising and annoying to learn that your data was not safe on someone else’s server. You can get outraged at the other party for charging you or for not keeping your data in storage like they didn’t promise to do. Yet it is a fact of life.

OGS did not violate your trust. I would not “trust” OGS to do my laundry. If I promise to review your game and then I don’t, that is a violation of trust. You have no reason not to trust anyone, that’s ridiculous.

Then you blast @arnaudgo for his criticism, which was even constructive (indulging/avoiding your “trust” narrative, focussing on what you could have done instead of “what you did wrong” etc). This doubling-down and not apologizing for anything leaves with me the impression of a self-centered grumpy person with a priority on winning internet arguments.


Alright, I accept that you have a huge double-standard for criticism. I accidentally thought that this was not the case. So please continue to attack me personally while ignoring anything written in my posts and continue to speculate how to wipe all data because hey, it is just a valuable life lesson, and it is not as if it was the gratuitous speculation that annoyed me and the devs certainly appreciate this kind of defense.

PS: You conveniently overlooked all “doubling-down” by everyone else because you do not regard me as a person deserving the same regard as those who share your point of view.

T̶r̶o̶h̶d̶e̶ ̶h̶a̶s̶ ̶s̶a̶i̶d̶ ̶m̶u̶l̶t̶i̶p̶l̶e̶ ̶t̶i̶m̶e̶s̶ ̶t̶h̶a̶t̶ ̶w̶h̶a̶t̶ ̶t̶h̶e̶y̶ ̶s̶a̶i̶d̶ ̶w̶a̶s̶ ̶a̶ ̶j̶o̶k̶e̶,̶ a sort of looking on the brighter side of thing that it could have been much worse. Trohde has no part of the OGS development and is just a moderator so using them as an excuse is meh.

Playing on the person is a trap. It is the discussion of ideas that is generally supported, not the tone in which they are voiced even when that happens in a deficient way, colored by disturbing emotions. Avoid the trap, I would say, of losing patience and compassion in your tone, when it is the communication of ideas that counts.


Hey there, Tom here, aka @trohde (aka “Bonobo” on other forums)

Thanks for your support, but please let me try to explain: it was NOT a joke, it was just a lighthearted expression of my own personal feelings about games played here. And it was sort of a speculation …

I was honestly thinking that it might perhaps be better or easier to just start off with a clean slate, so to speak, i.e. to p!ss off ALL users just for one once instead of annoying a significant number of users for a longer time. This was said naïvely, sort of, since I don’t understand all the things that make OGS work as a software, IANAC (I am not a coder).

I didn’t intend to anger you, @Wulfenia, and I am really sorry for your loss, and also that you took my words so personally as it seems to be the case. I appreciate the co-operation you have shown here with regard to bugs, etc., but please try to step back a bit from all this and read my comment in that other thread again with my explanation in mind.

Peace, Tom


Ah, my mistake. Sorry about that.


No worries … all is well. Mostly, that is :wink: We’re all hoping that there will be no more collateral damage. And no asteroid impacts, of course.

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