Novice question here: All the examples I find are very simple, consisting of a straight line (or a single stone) surrounded by stones on one side and then you place a stone at the tip of this line. This is the “reaching around”. But I remember seeing someone call a move in a more complex shape a hane, so obviously the term can be applied more generically than a stone at the tip of a straight line. In a more semi-formal way, what is a hane? To check my intuition, which of these moves can be called a hane?
Another ones, still hane right? The first one, you just say that the hane is on the left group and the second is a … “double hane”, but I see this word is reserved to a specific situation so a … double group hane?
I wonder if the answers are focused more on technical definition than on common usage.
Thinking about the the technical definition, I can see many of those are “hane”, but up to this point I’ve only heard in common usage hane around a single stone or a stick (like the last one).
This is partly why the wedge isn’t a hane. Technically it might be, but you wouldn’t say “hane” yo’d say “wedge”.
Hmm, i’ve never heard anybody refer to a hane as a kosumi. personally, i only use the word “kosumi” for a move that makes this diagonal shape, such that the most recently-placed stone is not connected to another chain and is not attaching to an opponent’s stone. maybe some people use the term ‘kosumi’ more broadly, but not that i’ve commonly observed. i’d be curious if anybody has insight into how Japanese players use the term.
not trying to argue with you, but do you know whether other people use this more exclusive version of “hane”, or is it a personal preference? i’ve never heard anybody define “hane” in relation to local thickness, but also the given positions of 1, 2, and 5 are rather contrived, so i’ve definitely never encountered a situation where such a position was being discussed with technical jargon, so i wouldn’t really know.
I’ve only ever heard the hane-wedge referred to as the ‘wedge’; not a ‘hane’, not a ‘hane-wedge’. i did, however, just look it up and find this : Hanekomi at Sensei’s Library, so it seems that at least in Japanese, it might not be abnormal to call it a hane. i think if you call this a hane in english, though, people will assume you’re confused or mistaken, but they’ll probably understand you
That’s true, when I ask “what is a hane?”, this time I’m more interested in how the word is used in most social contexts, instead of a definition, following Wittgenstein. But if such a definition exists, I won’t deny knowing what it is
By the way, so “wedge” is placing a stone in the middle of two opponent stones (separated by a 1-point jump), that’s all?
I personally think a wedge is like a hane in respect of how many opponent stones there are.
If there’s more than one stone (or a stick leading away) on both sides, it’d be odd to call it a wedge (from my limited experience). It’d be more like “a blunder”
“See the surprise on the commentator’s faces as AlphaGo wedges Sedol’s bamboo joint!”
But there are sticks leading away from both sides in my examples 9 and A (ok, just one stone in one side). I thought you agreed with @Samraku and they should be called wedges.
well i certainly disagree that the definition i gave deviates from actual usage, given that it is how i use it in discussion with other folks who also use it that way
