What do I do if I obviously win a game and the site give opponent all the points and the game? There seems no one to complain to.
On the right-hand side panel of the game page, there is a call moderator button. I think that’s the best place to raise game dispute issues.
If your opponent marks your stones as dead when they aren’t, first click on them to mark them as alive again (this is called a scoring dispute). If your opponent keeps marking your live stones as dead, call a moderator.
The Call Moderator button on the sidebar is what you’re looking for. Since I’m on the mod team and I’m seeing the complaint now, I found the game that was wrongly scored and annulled the result. It’s the most I can do, since mods can’t actually re-score a game.
One last note: the site didn’t give your opponent the points. What happened is that your opponent changed the score by clicking on the stones, and you accepted that score, like @smurph mentioned.
It should be noted that sometimes inexperienced players in this situation don’t know what to do, and the scoring clock times out with the wrong score in place even though the victim did not accept it.
The quickest way to counter the cheater is to click the autoscore button, which resets the preliminary scoring.
I curious. Does the system guard against the race condition where player a scores the game and pushes the accept button, then player b changes the dead stone status just before player a’s accept button click is taken by the server?
If so, I have a suggestion to fix.
If I recall correctly, yes, the button is grayed out for two seconds after a change.
Hmm… That doesn’t actually stop the problem. It could still be the case that my opponent submits a change at the same time I hit the button, and his change gets to the server before my button press. Then the server accepts his change and my button press which is already in flight but arrives two seconds later.
Grab a friend, play a game and try to have him cheat you out of a victory with this “yahoo method”. Stream it on twitch for added credibility.
I had it happen where the other player re-scored and I accepted before checking to see he had de-selected most of my points. Slimy. Fortunately it was unranked. Shame on me for not looking lol
“yahoo method” LOL! That sure gave me the laughs.
Is Yahoo! Games even a thing these days?
It could be possible that the submit button actually also sends the status being confirmed. If that’s the case, the server could potentially detect and avoid that type of problem.
Yea, that’s what I was thinking, but even here the screen could update and then the user taps the submit without realizing it. The fundamental problem is that the user is being expected to accept something that is changing in real time.
I think the best solution would be to have each player independently score the game and then hit submit. If the two scores don’t match the server could reject both or go back into game play mode. It’s too confusing to have to hit the submit button when stones and territories are flashing all over the place on the board through someone else’s actions.
^^^ good idea!
Except for the fact that you’ll then have to somehow find a clever solution to display how your opponent’s scoring differs from yours. And that 100% of Go players around the world are used to the simultaneous version.
Sounds quite nontrivial to me. I also don’t see the demand. After a player has learned how scoring works, they’re very unlikely to miss someone’s changes to the score.
Actually, a frequent cause of moderator requests is “argh, I didn’t mean to accept that score” or “how come the score is not what I accepted” variants.
The scoring phase, and “stone acceptance process” in particular, is the biggest source of moderator requests, so any potential solution deserves consideration.
I do see that the problem of showing “what needs to be reconciled” could be tricky, but honestly it maybe no worse than what happens now, which is a mad flashing of the board as the opponents dispute and get frustrated and click like mad.
I can see how lots of people who aren’t yet familiar with the scoring system could encounter this problem once.
I can not see how that problem would still persist after people have encountered it once.
What’s the median rank and # of games_played for users who complain about a wrong score? Is there anyone who complained more than once? Complaints about griefers - for example those who deliberately mark live stones as dead - don’t count, because you’d get those under any other system as well.
I think that one contributing factor is griefers.
For sure they will operate under any system, but presumably some systems will be more robust than others.
Possibly people are slower on the uptake than you might ideally think, also.
I would like to see to score somewhere before I accept, in the same fashion as it is shown after scoring.
‘One number to rule them all and in the darkness bind them.’
Maybe everyone knows, but just to make sure
These numbers represent the current board status (during scoring phase) and if accepted the final result is counted “from” those. Granted it is not as simple as the end result, but I think easy enough to see “my number is bigger, I can safely accept” / “my number is smaller, better check if everything is marked correctly”