Yeonwoo and the Popular 3-4 Joseki

In Yeonwoo’s 3-4 Joseki Lecture, she mentions that most professionals now end the popular 3-4 joseki early and consider the popular stabilizing moves slow. This thread is for discussing how that observation might impact the position in our dictionary. Here’s relevant chat from earlier:

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This is a hasty judgement. Yeonwoo is a wonderful source but she isn’t the only one. (at some point we will need to address how to handle source priority)

For now, my point is that in games from August of 2018 until November 2019 professional players (are also a primary source for a Joseki dictionary) treat it as very urgent to finish the joseki.

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Your point that Yeonwoo isn’t the only source is well taken. At the same time, your graphic does not exactly contradict what she is saying. It shows local continuations for the 11x12(?) search area. It does not tell you whether AB are played immediately after the marked black move. If anything, it supports Yeonwoo’s point, because even with these limitations pros did not play AB in about 110 of 407 cases (86 tenukis and some black moves at AB). All it shows is that White did end up playing AB, either immediately or after some delay, nearly 300 times.

I added one final image. White continues on that side of the board in 70% of the times it was played in November 2019 so far.

Also:

It does tell you exactly that information.

… inside the search area. It does not tell you how many moves were played outside of the search area before a move inside the search area is played. If I understand kombilo rightly, that is how it operates.

I mean, if you play moves outside the search area, the output remains the same. It’s the same as searching in waltheri’s tool in this respect.

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I’m sure you have a misunderstanding about Kombilo. I’ve clicked through about 100 of them by now, all after the previous move.

It is never the same as waltheri’s tool. You are absolutely mistaken here.


In the 219(A) bar, you can barely see the sliver of Grey. Those are the positions in which White plays ‘A’ after a move outside of the search field. The white in the bar is when white responds immediately with the move. I can give you these 348 games to click through if you would like to find more than ten(five?) cases where A is played after a tenuki.

This grey is more noticeable in the ‘B’ variation.

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I remember that Drago implements the Kombilo features so well. The urgency bar = times the move is played immediately / times the move is played period.

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Thanks. That’s the kind of information I’m looking for.