I think this is the issue that is troubling me about this whole thing. I suspect that the sandbaggers that are complained about and those whose games are annulled are in the main not really trying to sandbag especially. While those who are actually sandbagging are not so easily caught if at all.
I have no data of course but if my hypothesis is along the right lines then I wonder if the cure is worse than the disease. Or if there should be as much effort directed to it as other sources of inaccuracies in the ranking system (misclick, drunk players etc)
That sometimes happens when multiple players use the same account. I feel like I’ve played an account where students have been switching off and the rank is completely useless.
But for a single person to do that, taking such care to manipulate rank doesn’t seem worth the effort
At the risk of getting too philosophical or legal about this, isn’t another interpretation than annulment means the thing is treated as never having happened. In that case how can you win something that didn’t happen? And if something is changed from having happened (that you won) to not having happened (that by definition you cannot win since there was nothing to win) then your win has been “taken away”.
I’m not arguing for one interpretation of another. I just think that if we get to this level of analysis it can be argued either way and will not help us move forward.
I just want to point out that luck is a skill but also that could be argued as an opinion since not everyone thinks luck is a skill.
I actually believe BIBA use to run a school and had an account where they would have all of there students use it at the same time and they would collectively come up with the next move together and they all ranged from kyu to high dan. Not positive on that but I am almost certain. Was really interesting stuff but that is another topic in itself.
After Steve manages to reach 15k undetected, he could just play unranked games against 15k (he doesn’t care about his rating anyway).
The “sandbagger game annullment policy” does not protect his opponents from having a bad experience of getting sandbagged, because the games are already unranked. Or will their opponents not be bothered, because those games are unranked?
Will this type of sandbagger stay under the radar? Or is his behaviour not even violating any OGS rules?
It’s not even sandbagging, really. If I don’t ever play a ranked game on OGS again (as I plan to do) but keep getting stronger by playing unranked games, am I forced to play ranked games here and there so that my rank adjusts?
It’s not my fault if I get stronger and my rank doesn’t show it, if I don’t want to play ranked games.
No, I know a couple people who can’t stand to play ranked. And they stay a [?] forever
If one day they decide to start playing ranked, I imagine they will have few wonky match up, but it will remedy itself quickly enough. The system was built to handle it
That sounds really interesting; ut I’d prefer if none of the players knew each other’s ranks. People just default to doing whatever the strongest/most assertive person says and that’s not very interesting to me.
For learning purposes I would also prefer if none of knew the ranks of each other. I know the account was 9dan though. So I definitely assume it was almost always what the higher rated player said.
Yeah a lot is lost in learning if people can’t try out their ideas and see them fail.
If the strong player let the weaker player make the macro choices, and then the string player had to deal with the sequences and struggle to make it a good outcome, it would probably be beneficial learning for both.
Now there’s a radical suggestion. How about we hide ranks altogether!?
Why do we really need to know our rank?
If the answer is “to see progress” … how about have it visible only on the rating graph. So you can see progress, but it is not a widespread tool for ego boosting and dispute…
But seriously, I think rank is actually a very useful tool, and not just to see improvement. One example is I meet another player IRL and want to know if it’s logical to start even or throw a couple stones on. It’s useful to be able to mention rank on a well-known server like OGS.
I had my first games without knowing either my own or my opponents rank - so far it is enjoyable and relaxed - it will take some time to really build myself an opinion tho. ^^
but also that could be argued as an opinion since not everyone thinks luck is a skill.
