(from discussion in another topic)
there should be way to leave rengo without ending it. Because otherwise they will just resign by not Go reasons anyway, or worse - leave and timeout.
If others will not like to continue such game, they can just press “leave” button too.
But those who wish to continue - should have right to do so.
if there will be 2 options, yes its about “fun” option
I assume we’re talking about the “fun” option, with individual clocks, here? If so, I agree, this definitely seems in the spirit of it.
Why resign causal rengo is recorded as dropped game on one’s profile? From my rough and raw view, “drop out” is not a proper word for causal rengo.
Merriam-Webster’s Advanced Learner’s English Dictionary:
dropout:
OGS DOC:
Stick or Causal:
When the game actually ends it will show as such in game history. The drop out section is just a place to store rengo games that are neither “active” (since you aren’t playing) or “history” (since the game is not over).
It is not permanently in dropout section.
One concrete problem with casual rengo is that we don’t have a “team concensus resign” function.
It was never my intent that casual rengo should “support” individuals stopping playing one at a time when it suited them.
Rather, its original intent was to simply to protect the team from players dropping out by timeout and prematurely ending the game. This was viewed (by me) as a dishonourable thing to do that was causing problems with rengo.
That’s why it’s called “drop out”.
At the time that I put this feature in place, I did not support this idea.
I still don’t support the idea that “everyone (or anyone) has the right to time out” as a general statement.
IF you run out of time to think about a move in a live game, then sure, that’s a valid timeout.
But casual players in rengo timeout mostly because they lose interest, IMO.
The person who has the turn is the person who decides for the team whether the game is over or not by passing or resigning. A “resign” should mean that the team resigns.
The other players should have no influence on the game - it is not their turn.
Some things have changed since then - I’ve come to appreciate that more support for even more casual involvement is something people would like, and also we’ve discovered that the implementation that was put in place at that time was not ideal.
That’s the history of why it is how it is. I am still not entirely comfortable with the idea that players time out of rengo games, much as players should not time out of any games. It’s rude, IMO.
But it is certainly the case that the way casual rengo games can end could do with some tweaking.
… but there are a number of things higher on The List than this.
Just confirming some thoughts on this … it’s the fact that “resignation” doesn’t resign the whole team that causes confusion: surely “resigning” is not “rude”, therefore it must be “OK” … this leads to Norvig’s conclusion: that individuals have the “right” to leave the tean.
Initially “casual mode” was designed to protect against timeouts, but it resulted in “resignation” also being an “individual act”.
If only we had concensus-resign. Hmmm. It feels like a “big kinda feature”, not “a small thing to add”.
Sounds like you need a “leave” button in addition to a “resign” one! One to drop out instead of having to wait for your turn and timing out and one to end the game for everyone if you think that’s appropriate… The latter sounds dangerous though. Or at least would take some getting used to!
Yeah, there’s definitely a discussion to be had about whether in casual rengo a single person should have the power to resign on behalf of the team.
This is what “real” rengo players have.
But I would say that evidence/experience tells us “this will never work - someone will always mess it up by resigning too soon”, which is why we accepted the compromise of “a casual player resigning just drops them”.
The missing piece is “OK, so how is the game supposed to end, other than passing??”
I’m pretty sure the best answer would be “concensus resign” 
I suppose another answer would be “you always play to the dame in casual rengo, and pass when it’s time to finish the game” 
No resigning.
This would help ensure everyone gets a turn, in those huge games 
(It’d also be a super-easy change 
)
1 person should not be able to end casual rengo with 500 players
so I think there should be 2 buttons: “leave” and “vote for resign”
those who “vote for resign” do not leave
those who leave or timeout do not have right to vote
among people who still not left, everyone is “against resign” by default
when more than 50% of still active players vote for resign, game ends by resign.
It seems that in “real” rengo, teammates are allowed to discuss whether or not they should resign. Thus, there is some sort of consensus required there as well.
Does the server know which players left by resigning? Perhaps the resign button could also serve as a vote button. Then the game ends when a certain threshold of players on the team have left by resigning.
currently too many people resign because they want to leave, not because they want game to end. If leave by resign would be counted as vote, game will suddenly end when true players don’t wish it
And what if they resigned on different moves? That’s not much of a consensus.
Sometimes they leave because of bad ownership than the opponent team. The game don’t need to continue… It’s over already.
I’ve never played Rengo live myself, but I “heard that” the players aren’t allowed to discuss the game…
I guess since it’s casual, maybe there doesn’t need to be any provision for a team resigning. Just change the “resign” button for a “leave” button and the game ends when the whole team has left (or two passes ofc)
Casual rengo is an entirely OGS thing right? So we can do whatever we want! (If only we knew what we wanted…)
I dig it
Then there could be ultra-casual with free leaving and joining of a game in progress?
Revolving door rengo? It would be mayhem, and I’m not saying it like a bad thing.
